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Author Topic:   An Ether-Based Creation Model
Phat
Inactive Member


Message 226 of 305 (887351)
08-01-2021 6:55 AM
Reply to: Message 198 by dwise1
07-31-2021 10:21 AM


Re: This Thread Expressed Through Cartoons
dwise1 writes:

What a complete farking icehole you are! (Quick! Name that movie! It's your only chance at Redemption.)

Though I confess I consulted the Oracle, I came up with Roman Moronie's speech:

Perhaps by consulting a human-created Oracle I lost my opportunity at redemption, but I will still keep praying for all of us and not just myself.

EvC can be a holy place if we follow rule 10 in the Forum Guidelines


"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
“…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox

“The whole war between the atheist and the theist comes down to this: the atheist believes a 'what' created the universe; the theist believes a 'who' created the universe.”
- Criss Jami, Killo

“The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
(1894).


This message is a reply to:
 Message 198 by dwise1, posted 07-31-2021 10:21 AM dwise1 has not yet responded

  
Phat
Inactive Member


Message 227 of 305 (887352)
08-01-2021 6:59 AM
Reply to: Message 225 by AZPaul3
08-01-2021 6:53 AM


Re: Get Real.
AZ writes:

Actually, there is an energy force that is blowing this universe apart in an accelerating expansion of spacetime and the expected long-term results will be the death of the universe by freezing. Eventually, the last photon will be expanded out of existence. The Heat Death of the universe.


My questions would likely be as follows:
  • Will darkness and Light still exist in theory if not objectively?
  • Will our minds and souls exist long after our bodies have been vanquished?
  • Can we make a conscious choice to be part of light or part of darkness and, if so, do we know which is which?

    "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
    ***
    “…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox

    “The whole war between the atheist and the theist comes down to this: the atheist believes a 'what' created the universe; the theist believes a 'who' created the universe.”
    - Criss Jami, Killo

    “The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
    (1894).


  • This message is a reply to:
     Message 225 by AZPaul3, posted 08-01-2021 6:53 AM AZPaul3 has responded

    Replies to this message:
     Message 229 by AZPaul3, posted 08-01-2021 7:16 AM Phat has responded
     Message 233 by ringo, posted 08-01-2021 10:31 AM Phat has responded

      
    AZPaul3
    Member
    Posts: 5984
    From: Phoenix
    Joined: 11-06-2006
    Member Rating: 3.6


    Message 228 of 305 (887353)
    08-01-2021 7:08 AM
    Reply to: Message 217 by ICANT
    08-01-2021 12:28 AM


    Re: Get Real.
    The reality is that space is contracting between Andromeda and the Milky Way.

    No. This is the most stupid thing i've read in many months.

    When you drive to the store do you say the space, the road, between your car and the store is contracting?

    Our local group is gravitationally bound. That overrides the force of the expansion.

    You didn't read or comprehend the explanation I gave in my message, did you!

    You can't comprehend this stuff. Why are you arguing? Just to look stupid?


    Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

    This message is a reply to:
     Message 217 by ICANT, posted 08-01-2021 12:28 AM ICANT has responded

    Replies to this message:
     Message 243 by ICANT, posted 08-03-2021 12:20 AM AZPaul3 has responded

      
    AZPaul3
    Member
    Posts: 5984
    From: Phoenix
    Joined: 11-06-2006
    Member Rating: 3.6


    Message 229 of 305 (887354)
    08-01-2021 7:16 AM
    Reply to: Message 227 by Phat
    08-01-2021 6:59 AM


    Re: Get Real.
    I hope you didn't expect me to answer any of that crap, Phat.

    Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

    This message is a reply to:
     Message 227 by Phat, posted 08-01-2021 6:59 AM Phat has responded

    Replies to this message:
     Message 230 by Phat, posted 08-01-2021 7:24 AM AZPaul3 has responded
     Message 236 by Phat, posted 08-01-2021 10:47 AM AZPaul3 has responded

      
    Phat
    Inactive Member


    Message 230 of 305 (887355)
    08-01-2021 7:24 AM
    Reply to: Message 229 by AZPaul3
    08-01-2021 7:16 AM


    Re: Get Real.
    I didn't. But I expected you to think a bit about philosophy and about how not all religionist types are clueless and dense. Not that I claim any special status yet. It's all up to my Boss. And He cares about you too, even though you don't knowingly work for Him.

    Edited by Phat, : spelling


    "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
    ***
    “…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox

    “The whole war between the atheist and the theist comes down to this: the atheist believes a 'what' created the universe; the theist believes a 'who' created the universe.”
    - Criss Jami, Killo

    “The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
    (1894).


    This message is a reply to:
     Message 229 by AZPaul3, posted 08-01-2021 7:16 AM AZPaul3 has responded

    Replies to this message:
     Message 231 by AZPaul3, posted 08-01-2021 7:37 AM Phat has not yet responded

      
    AZPaul3
    Member
    Posts: 5984
    From: Phoenix
    Joined: 11-06-2006
    Member Rating: 3.6


    Message 231 of 305 (887356)
    08-01-2021 7:37 AM
    Reply to: Message 230 by Phat
    08-01-2021 7:24 AM


    Re: Get Real.
    But I expected you to think a bit about philosophy and about how not all religionist types are clueless and dense.

    But, Phat, that is not true. We already know, and have known for centuries, that religious types are in fact clueless, dense, illogical, violent, dangerous and evil. Down right stupid is what they are, Phat. This is fact. We know this.


    Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

    This message is a reply to:
     Message 230 by Phat, posted 08-01-2021 7:24 AM Phat has not yet responded

      
    Percy
    Member
    Posts: 20219
    From: New Hampshire
    Joined: 12-23-2000
    Member Rating: 4.8


    Message 232 of 305 (887359)
    08-01-2021 9:52 AM
    Reply to: Message 221 by Michael MD
    08-01-2021 5:53 AM


    Re: Fair Warning
    As everyone keeps telling you, transitioning your ether ideas from fantasy to the realm of possibility requires evidence. Continuing to ramble on with word salads won't produce any evidence.

    Einstein realized new theory was needed because Newtonian physics couldn't explain how the world would appear to someone traveling at the speed of light.

    You realized new theory was needed because...

    You need to replace the ellipsis with some observation of the real world.

    --Percy


    This message is a reply to:
     Message 221 by Michael MD, posted 08-01-2021 5:53 AM Michael MD has not yet responded

      
    ringo
    Member
    Posts: 19226
    From: frozen wasteland
    Joined: 03-23-2005
    Member Rating: 3.7


    Message 233 of 305 (887362)
    08-01-2021 10:31 AM
    Reply to: Message 227 by Phat
    08-01-2021 6:59 AM


    Re: Get Real.
    Phat writes:

    Can we make a conscious choice to be part of light or part of darkness and, if so, do we know which is which?


    Have you ever heard of the concept of metaphor? Do you realize that light/darkness (good/evil) has nothing, nothing and also nothing to do with actual physical light?

    "I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

    This message is a reply to:
     Message 227 by Phat, posted 08-01-2021 6:59 AM Phat has responded

    Replies to this message:
     Message 234 by Phat, posted 08-01-2021 10:37 AM ringo has responded

      
    Phat
    Inactive Member


    Message 234 of 305 (887363)
    08-01-2021 10:37 AM
    Reply to: Message 233 by ringo
    08-01-2021 10:31 AM


    Re: Get Real.
    of course, I knew that and was in fact employing such a metaphor in light of my question to AZPaul3. He has yet to admit that his mind is not eternal nor is our collective. We are not God. (Even if one cannot be proven)
    Light is a metaphor for a loving Deity, though some may argue that if a Deity exists there is no promise that such a Power is Good. I would of course argue otherwise, for hope becomes a lot stronger when at least one of us knows the way out of the forest.

    "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
    ***
    “…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox

    “The whole war between the atheist and the theist comes down to this: the atheist believes a 'what' created the universe; the theist believes a 'who' created the universe.”
    - Criss Jami, Killo

    “The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
    (1894).


    This message is a reply to:
     Message 233 by ringo, posted 08-01-2021 10:31 AM ringo has responded

    Replies to this message:
     Message 235 by ringo, posted 08-01-2021 10:43 AM Phat has not yet responded

      
    ringo
    Member
    Posts: 19226
    From: frozen wasteland
    Joined: 03-23-2005
    Member Rating: 3.7


    Message 235 of 305 (887365)
    08-01-2021 10:43 AM
    Reply to: Message 234 by Phat
    08-01-2021 10:37 AM


    Re: Get Real.
    Phat writes:

    Light is a metaphor for a loving Deity....


    Lucifer means light.

    Phat writes:

    ... hope becomes a lot stronger when at least one of us knows the way out of the forest.


    You're the one who's always preaching against objective reality, expecting your seeing-eye god to lead you. I prefer to look out for the trees.

    "I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

    This message is a reply to:
     Message 234 by Phat, posted 08-01-2021 10:37 AM Phat has not yet responded

      
    Phat
    Inactive Member


    Message 236 of 305 (887368)
    08-01-2021 10:47 AM
    Reply to: Message 229 by AZPaul3
    08-01-2021 7:16 AM


    Re: Get Real.
    AZPaul3 writes:

    I hope you didn't expect me to answer any of that crap, Phat.

    Why not? They are just simple questions. And Ringo, I expect the same from you. You guys cant wax philosophic about what science tells us will happen in 100 billion (give or take) years and then imply that you dont care about an eternal destiny or purpose...if not for you for your offspring.

    Which leads to a few more hypotheticals.

  • Is Creation and Generativity an ongoing process and if so, what role do (or should) humans play?
  • Is destruction part of the eternal narrative (sorta like a Yin Yang oscillating regenerating Universe aka Big Bang+Big Crunch type of scenario?
  • If so, what good does it do for humans to think no further than their next baby?

    Edited by Phat, : No reason given.


    "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
    ***
    “…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox

    “The whole war between the atheist and the theist comes down to this: the atheist believes a 'what' created the universe; the theist believes a 'who' created the universe.”
    - Criss Jami, Killo

    “The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
    (1894).


  • This message is a reply to:
     Message 229 by AZPaul3, posted 08-01-2021 7:16 AM AZPaul3 has responded

    Replies to this message:
     Message 237 by AZPaul3, posted 08-01-2021 7:37 PM Phat has acknowledged this reply
     Message 238 by ringo, posted 08-01-2021 9:33 PM Phat has not yet responded

      
    AZPaul3
    Member
    Posts: 5984
    From: Phoenix
    Joined: 11-06-2006
    Member Rating: 3.6


    Message 237 of 305 (887385)
    08-01-2021 7:37 PM
    Reply to: Message 236 by Phat
    08-01-2021 10:47 AM


    Re: Get Real.
    No, Phat.

    You confirmed in Message 230 that I didn't have to answer.

    It's too late. You are not a girl so you don't get to change your mind.


    Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

    This message is a reply to:
     Message 236 by Phat, posted 08-01-2021 10:47 AM Phat has acknowledged this reply

      
    ringo
    Member
    Posts: 19226
    From: frozen wasteland
    Joined: 03-23-2005
    Member Rating: 3.7


    Message 238 of 305 (887388)
    08-01-2021 9:33 PM
    Reply to: Message 236 by Phat
    08-01-2021 10:47 AM


    Re: Get Real.
    Phat writes:

    And Ringo, I expect the same from you.


    You have a lot of gall. Go back and answer the hundreds of my posts that you've ignored before you demand that I answer every thought that meanders through your mind.

    Phat writes:

    You guys cant wax philosophic about what science tells us will happen in 100 billion (give or take) years and then imply that you dont care about an eternal destiny or purpose...


    When have I ever done that?

    "I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

    This message is a reply to:
     Message 236 by Phat, posted 08-01-2021 10:47 AM Phat has not yet responded

      
    ringo
    Member
    Posts: 19226
    From: frozen wasteland
    Joined: 03-23-2005
    Member Rating: 3.7


    Message 239 of 305 (887390)
    08-01-2021 10:17 PM
    Reply to: Message 218 by ICANT
    08-01-2021 1:13 AM


    Re: Get Real.
    ICANT writes:

    ringo writes:

    There's a difference between "a" beginning and "the" beginning.


    What is the difference?

    The same as the difference between "a" big apple and "The" Big Apple.

    ICANT writes:

    I think you are dancing around my comment...


    No, I'm pointing out that your comment is nonsense based on your misunderstanding of simple English.

    ICANT writes:

    The Universe required a beginning to exist just like you did.


    That's an unsupported assertion.

    "I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

    This message is a reply to:
     Message 218 by ICANT, posted 08-01-2021 1:13 AM ICANT has responded

    Replies to this message:
     Message 242 by ICANT, posted 08-03-2021 12:00 AM ringo has responded

      
    ICANT
    Member
    Posts: 6426
    From: SSC
    Joined: 03-12-2007
    Member Rating: 1.7


    Message 240 of 305 (887393)
    08-02-2021 1:20 AM
    Reply to: Message 223 by Phat
    08-01-2021 6:14 AM


    Re: Get Real.
    Hi Phat

    Phat writes:

    Thus is it fair to say that you don't consider yourself a creationist in any way shape or form?

    That is correct.

    Energy can not be created therefore it has to have existed eternally.

    There had to be an eternal unlimited energy force to make the universe and hold it together.

    This existing energy is what was used to build the universe out of.

    Phat writes:

    Are you arguing that a Believer in God (the uncaused first cause hypothesis) is NOT a Creationist?

    No.

    There are many people who believe in God that believe He created the universe about 6,000 years ago and some go up to 10,000 years ago. Then you have the old earth creationist who believe in an old universe that was destroyed and had to be remodeled 6 to 10k years ago.

    Then there is me. You know what I believe.

    God Bless,


    "John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

    This message is a reply to:
     Message 223 by Phat, posted 08-01-2021 6:14 AM Phat has acknowledged this reply

      
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