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Author Topic:   Are You Racist?
dwise1
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Posts: 5930
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 5.8


Message 5 of 116 (888723)
09-30-2021 6:09 PM
Reply to: Message 4 by ringo
09-30-2021 12:07 PM


Orange shirts? Anti-Irish. Gotcha!
I talked with a Canadian friend a few decades ago. I had heard of the Fenian Invasions against Canada, basically the Irish immigrants recruited by either side for the US Cival War who then turned their attention against their mutual enemy, John Bull (English Britain), by attacking Canada. USA students never ever hear of that, but Canadian students are well-versed in it. Funny how different countries teach history differently, isn't it?
 
That same friend told me that on St. Patrick's Day where "everybody" wears Green in sympathy with the Irish, Canadians make a point of wearing orange in opposition to the Irish.
So being nearly half-Irish (other half completely Scottish), could you possibly pick a different color?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4 by ringo, posted 09-30-2021 12:07 PM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
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dwise1
Member
Posts: 5930
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 5.8


Message 7 of 116 (888726)
09-30-2021 11:43 PM
Reply to: Message 6 by Percy
09-30-2021 7:27 PM


Re: More on Racism
Also sort of replying to everyone ...
Bart Simpson and Milhouse watching a vintage century-old Itchy-and-Scratchy cartoon ... "Look out! It's an Irishman!"
Yes, I'm white, but I'm also almost pure Celtic (minus 1/16 German) and hence also traditionally racially discriminated against (I also used to be Mexican by marriage (until they kicked me out via the divorce) ). Definitely not WASP (we Scots always keep a wary eye on Saxons (AKA "English" -- Scotland's favorite team in the Soccer World Championship is always "ABE", "Anybody But England") ). Since I have never made any of the white supremacist meetings (the names on all their emails look much too sketchy so I select them as Spam), I have no idea what they think of us Irish.
Xenophobia, fear of the others, is normal and baked very solidly into our DNA. Feeling uneasy among others who are a bit too different is normal.
In a diversified culture, feeling a bit uncomfortable stepping into a different culture is to be expected. But it shouldn't be a barrier.
Racism isn't just mere xenophobia, but rather using normal xenophobia against others. Especially when making laws.
Not being racist (aware of our inherent differences) is not just as per a "Points to Ponder" in one of the Readers' Digest next to my father's toilet (circa VietNam War): US Army Sgt: "I don't see white nor black nor brown nor yellow. All I see is green! MOVE OUT!" Rather, not being racist is a matter of treating every individual the same as everybody else.
Everybody is racist in that we all naturally react xenophobically to others.
Racism is allowing that natural reaction to affect how we treat others. Even to the point of enacting laws and practices based on that reaction.

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dwise1
Member
Posts: 5930
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 5.8


(2)
Message 45 of 116 (897900)
09-15-2022 12:35 PM
Reply to: Message 43 by Tanypteryx
09-14-2022 11:33 PM


Re: What sort of Ist are you?
Yes, there's a little thing that happened which I guess he never noticed: The Twentieth Century.

This message is a reply to:
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dwise1
Member
Posts: 5930
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 5.8


(1)
Message 48 of 116 (897996)
09-17-2022 1:15 PM
Reply to: Message 47 by ringo
09-17-2022 12:28 PM


Re: What sort of Ist are you?
You like Trump, don't you?
Of course, he is dedicated to The Beast. The same as so many of his fellow "true Christians".
And I'm certain that he is also enraged that Trump had lost the election, because that constitutes yet another failed "biblical prophesy." In order for the Beast to perform his evil tasks, he needs to be in a position of power. So by losing the election (and subsequently demonstrating what a really bigly loser he is) Trump has caused that prophesy to fail. And that really grinds at the craw of those "true Christians" who worship The Beast, as wickless obviously does.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 47 by ringo, posted 09-17-2022 12:28 PM ringo has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 49 by Phat, posted 09-17-2022 4:03 PM dwise1 has replied
 Message 51 by candle2, posted 09-18-2022 9:56 AM dwise1 has not replied
 Message 53 by Phat, posted 09-18-2022 10:19 AM dwise1 has not replied

  
dwise1
Member
Posts: 5930
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 5.8


(4)
Message 50 of 116 (898038)
09-17-2022 5:37 PM
Reply to: Message 49 by Phat
09-17-2022 4:03 PM


Re: What sort of Ist are you?
Ever watch The Best Little Whorehouse in Texas (1982)? Charles Durning plays the Texas Governor whose big number is "The Sidestep":
With that little sidestep you just performed, you too could qualify as Governor of Texas. Though that would come with a very big down-side: you'd have to move to Texas.
To commiserate with you on that horrific prospect, within a few years I'll have to move to Florida. The extremely bizarre political landscape in Texas that we have all been observing (unless you're locked into the FOX bubble) is that Texas is desperately trying to out-Florida Florida.
 
My close friend of 14 years whom we lost two years ago, hailed from Texas, kind of. An Air Force brat all her life, her father retired to San Antonio while she was in high school, so she ran away to Southern California (well, during her childhood he was based at Norton AFB).
Over dinner one day, she told me about Gov. Rick Perry for the first that I had ever heard of him. Perry was Governor of Texas after G. Dubya Bush. We all know what the country though of Dubya's mental capacity ("dummy" comes to mind, though his facial expression of befuddlement is dwarfed by Tucker Carlson's just about all the time). She told me that, compared to Rick Perry, Texans took to referring to Bush as "the smart one."

This message is a reply to:
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dwise1
Member
Posts: 5930
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 5.8


Message 63 of 116 (898278)
09-21-2022 6:21 PM
Reply to: Message 61 by candle2
09-21-2022 5:37 PM


Re: What sort of Ist are you?
And, I have no idea who Bishop Ussher is.
Jessica H. Christ! Do you truly know nothing? Not even of your own position?
Bishop James Ussher:
quote:
James Ussher (or Usher; 4 January 1581 – 21 March 1656) was the Church of Ireland Archbishop of Armagh and Primate of All Ireland between 1625 and 1656. He was a prolific scholar and church leader, who today is most famous for his identification of the genuine letters of the church father, Ignatius of Antioch, and for his chronology that sought to establish the time and date of the creation as "the entrance of the night preceding the 23rd day of October... the year before Christ 4004"; that is, around 6 pm on 22 October 4004 BC, per the proleptic Julian calendar.
So as Phat told you in his Message 62 reply, Bishop Ussher is the source of YEC BS claims of the earth only being about 6,000 years old (they only say "no older than 10,000 years old" because everybody (except for you) knows that 4004 BCE date for the Creation, so saying "6000 years" would immediately expose their deceptive game of "Hide the Bible" (remember that the entire idea of "creation science" was to hide the fact that science has nothing to do with creationism but rather it is entirely religious and hence doesn't belong in public schools). Why can you never keep up?
Have you never spent a rainy afternoon by going through all the begats in Genesis to figure out Biblical chronology? Of course, we hit a wall (not unlike The Wall of slavery hit by black genealogists trying to do their family histories) in that Genesis only gets us to the Flood.
However, in 1996 a local YEC reprinted an article which also works through the various kings to find an external historic event to use as a tie-point -- well, being a typical creationist, he claimed it as his how, but I'm sure that he had plagiarized it. I reprinted his article by copying it as faithfully as I could: ARE THERE GAPS IN THE GENEALOGIES IN DETERMINING WHEN ADAM LIVED?:
quote:
Bill Morgan in 1996:
Since I feel the Bible clearly teaches Adam was created during 6 literal days of the creation of the Universe, this places the age of the Universe at about 6181 years. That is another study which I will gladly mail to you.
My Commentary in 2017:
By the way, Bill figures the earth to be 424 years older than the Jewish Calendar does, 1996 November 01 having been the 19th of Cheshvan (the third month) of 5757. The present counting method for years use the Anno Mundi epoch (Latin for "in the year of the world"), abbreviated AM or A.M. and also referred to as the Hebrew era. Hebrew year 5771 (a leap year) began on 9 September 2010 and ended on 28 September 2011. Hebrew year 5772 began at sunset on 28 September 2011 and ended on 16 September 2012. I'll leave to you the task of figuring what the Hebrew year is currently.

You're welcome.

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dwise1
Member
Posts: 5930
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 5.8


(1)
Message 109 of 116 (898868)
10-01-2022 4:08 PM
Reply to: Message 108 by Theodoric
10-01-2022 2:45 PM


Re: What sort of Ist are you?
Though my father was classically white looking he was Puerto Rican. In the 60's when I was a child, there were whole areas we could not live in because of that.
I was born and grew up in Orange County, Calif. and married into a Mexican family. My father-in-law and ex-wife are from Chicago, but his father was from northern Mexico and was mestizo (AKA "brownish") and so is my father-in-law. My mother-in-law is from Mexico City, but her family is primarily Spanish (AKA "rubia" meaning "blonde, light-skinned"). She kept her Mexican citizenship for many years so that they could buy property when they retired to Mexico, but then around 2000 they abandoned those plans and she finally became a US citizen. That meant that for about half a century she had a green card.
They would go down to Tijuana to go shopping (he loved to buy in bulk, especially food, so the garage was something of a warehouse). Coming back over the border, they would always stop him and check his legal status thoroughly, but wave her through, to which she'd ask them, "But don't you want to see my green card?" They'd always laugh about that.
 
The city of Fountain Valley was traditionally farmland until in the late 60's they decided to grow housing tracts instead, forcing out almost all the farms (a few small fields still remain). Nestled within those housing tracts you can find small clusters of older houses. It wasn't until I stumbled upon a late-40's Thomas Brothers wall map that I saw Fountain Valley sprinkled with a number of small communities called colonias.
A year or two ago I found an article about those colonias, but here's another article. Basically, established Orange County cities were redlined against Mexicans such that they could not buy a house but could only rent (further restricting where they could live). Starting in the 1920's, enterprising real estate developers started subdividing plots of land into lots and selling them to Mexicans, thus creating the colonias which have either been assimilated into the 60's tracts or surrounded by them. Most of those lots were large enough for a house, a small field (or large garden), and room for chickens and a cow or goats. Using Google Earth, you can still find some of those lots like in Colonia Juarez south of Mile Square Park and on Hazard just west of Euclid.

This message is a reply to:
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dwise1
Member
Posts: 5930
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 5.8


Message 112 of 116 (898887)
10-02-2022 1:51 AM
Reply to: Message 104 by candle2
10-01-2022 9:58 AM


Re: What sort of Ist are you?
You brain came about by random chance, nothing
but a mutation. It can't be trusted.
Nope! Nobody's brain came about by random chance, but rather the human brain evolved along with the body.
Evolution is not the same as random chance! Everybody who knows anything at all about evolution knows that! That you (in typical YEC fashion) would think such an utterly stupid and ignorant thing only demonstrates yet again how abjectly ignorant you are of what evolution is or how it works.
That means that your false claim of understanding evolution is just that, false! Just like your obvious lie that you " know how carbon dating works" (Message 482) while demonstrating repeatedly that you have absolutely no clue!
Let's see, the score of you demonstrating that you understand evolution to demonstrating that you don't is now about zero to ... so numerous and ubiquitous that we have lost count -- like the young child just learning to count: " ... Unos. ... Dos. ... ... ... Muchos!"
Mine was created by God.
Nope! Your highly fallible brain had the same origin as ringo's. You cannot possibly claim that your brain and ringo's had entirely separate and different origins. You're both in the same boat.
But then perhaps there is another interpretation for your appeal to you and ringo having resulted from separate creations. A very insidious one.
On occasion in my desire to understand everything, I have tried to find some kind of theoretical basis for Nazism, but usually in vain. In Rick Steves' episode on fascism in Europe, a historian compared the bookshelves of a Communist and of a Nazi. The Communist's bookshelf would be full of books filled with a lot of Marxist and socialist and economic theory; he has a lot of studying to do. The Nazi's bookshelf would contain only one book, Mein Kampf, which very few were ever able to read through, though they all needed to possess a copy (somewhat similar to "true Christians" all having and even carrying a Bible even though it's obvious that far too few of them have ever actually read it).
But one day I did stumble upon a site with materials from actual works of Nazi race theory -- it was an academic site studying those works rather than an actual Nazi or neo-Nazi site.
The most interesting thing I learned on that site is that Nazis were creationists! More specifically, they did believe in Creation (so much for the ubiquitious creationist lie that evolution caused Nazism) and that Aryans and Untermenschen ("sub-humans") were distinctly separate creations who must not be allowed to interbreed. Wow!
Then several months later I heard statements from the racists of the American South (19th century to the 20th at least) saying the exact same thing! Double wow! Though I had already known that American eugenics teachings had influenced Nazi race theory.
Then I watched via ZOOM a presentation by Dr. Eugenie Scott, former President of the National Center for Science Education (NCSE), "What People Get Wrong--And Sometimes Right--About Evolution." (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=80VWDi4Z_JM -- that's on YouTube). I had just previously discussed what I had watched via ZOOM in my Message 110 where I also discussed that Nazi literature study (Fuck your too-tiny phone screen! Read it anyway!).
Watching her video, I learned two new terms which I described in my Message 110:
DWise1 writes:
The question of race came up and Dr. Scott argued that Darwin, being a product of his times and of the British Empire, shared some of those prejudices and vocabulary of his culture. However, it turns out that Darwin was less racist than his contemporaries and the principles of Darwinian evolution run counter to popular racist sentiment and "theory".
Here are two new terms regarding race and the origins of the races:
  • monogenesis -- a theory of human origins which posits a single origin of humanity (eg, "out of Africa").
  • polygenesis -- a theory of human origins which posits the view that the human races are of different origins (polygenesis). Modern scientific views no longer favor the polygenic model, with the monogenic "Out of Africa" hypothesis and its variants being the most widely accepted models for human origins. Historically, polygenism has been used to advance racial inequality.
Dr. Scott pointed out that within evolution there is no such concept as race. It simply does not exist. Rather they speak of demes, local breeding populations or groups. Some demes can be isolated from the others or you can have demes that interbreed.
She also pointed out that Darwinism is monogenetic in that Darwin had explained racial differences as being variations as different human groups descended from a common human ancestor. That is in sharp contrast to the more racist use of polygenesis to argue that those other races entirely different critters from us "real humans".
Polygenesis, the belief that different kinds of people are the result of different acts of Creation by God and forms a theological basis for white supremacist racism, pretty much the basic topic here. Consider the question (taken from Inherit the Wind) of "Where did Cain's wife come from? Another creation over in the next county?" According to polygenesis, that would make sense. Remember 1966 feature movie with lots of big Hollywood stars (George G. Scott played Abraham), The Bible: In the Beginning...? At that point where Cain (Richard Harris -- told you it was a big production) has received the "Mark of Cain" and flees into the wilderness, the film then shows the descendants of Cain, African blacks, implying a common belief that the Mark of Cain is black skin (I shit thee not!):
quote:
American Protestant racial beliefs on the mark of Cain
At some point after the start of the slave trade in the United States, many Protestant denominations began teaching the belief that the mark of Cain was a dark skin tone in an attempt to justify their actions, although early descriptions of Romani as "descendants of Cain" written by Franciscan friar Symon Semeonis suggest that this belief had existed for some time. Protestant preachers wrote exegetical analyses of the curse, with the assumption that it was dark skin.
Baptist segregation
The split between the Northern and Southern Baptist organizations arose over doctrinal issues pertaining to slavery and the education of slaves. At the time of the split, the Southern Baptist group used the curse of Cain as a justification for slavery. Some 19th- and 20th-century Baptist ministers in the Southern United States taught the belief that there were two separate heavens; one for blacks, and one for whites. Southern Baptists either taught or practiced various forms of racial segregation well into the mid-20th century, though members of all races were accepted at worship services. In 1995, the Southern Baptist Convention officially denounced racism and apologized for its past defense of slavery.
The curse of Cain was used to support a ban on ordaining blacks to most Protestant clergies until the 1960s in both the United States and Europe. The majority of Christian churches in the world, including the Catholic Church, Eastern Orthodox churches, Anglican churches, and Oriental Orthodox churches, did not recognize these interpretations and did not participate in the religious movement to support them. Certain Catholic dioceses in the Southern United States adopted a policy of not ordaining blacks to oversee, administer the sacraments to, or accept confessions from white parishioners. This policy was not based on a "curse of Cain" teaching, but was justified by the widely held perception that slaves should not rule over their masters. However, this was not approved of by the Pope or by any papal teaching.

So then, candle2_casting_darkness, are you proposing a blatantly racist polygenetic model in which you and ringo were separately created?
Is that what you really believe? If not, then why say it that way?
What is wrong with you?
 

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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