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Author Topic:   Israel Declares War For The First Time Since 1973.
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9524
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 14 of 377 (913120)
10-11-2023 2:53 PM
Reply to: Message 13 by Phat
10-11-2023 2:39 PM


Re: It All Started With the Nakba
Phat writes:
You seem to think that booting religion and belief in God out of our heads will absolve that conflict.
The only people on this forum that believes that are believers in other religions.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London. Olen Suomi Soy Barcelona. I am Ukraine.

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 13 by Phat, posted 10-11-2023 2:39 PM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 15 by Phat, posted 10-11-2023 2:59 PM Tangle has replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9524
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 16 of 377 (913122)
10-11-2023 3:39 PM
Reply to: Message 15 by Phat
10-11-2023 2:59 PM


Re: It All Started With the Nakba
=Phat writes:
What makes you an optimist?
You think I'm an optimist?
Believing the world will not end tomorrow is not being optimistic.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London. Olen Suomi Soy Barcelona. I am Ukraine.

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 15 by Phat, posted 10-11-2023 2:59 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9524
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 102 of 377 (913327)
10-23-2023 3:37 PM
Reply to: Message 100 by GDR
10-23-2023 2:19 PM


Re: The Mid East War Ramps Up
Yeh right. God is supposed to be forgiveness. Just don't fuck with the Holy Spirit because he doesn't do that forgiveness stuff. Well fuck the Holy Spirit.
You can't believe this fantasy stuff, surely?

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London. Olen Suomi Soy Barcelona. I am Ukraine.

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 100 by GDR, posted 10-23-2023 2:19 PM GDR has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 105 by Phat, posted 10-23-2023 9:13 PM Tangle has replied
 Message 119 by GDR, posted 10-25-2023 5:36 PM Tangle has replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9524
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 5.5


(2)
Message 107 of 377 (913334)
10-24-2023 2:55 AM
Reply to: Message 105 by Phat
10-23-2023 9:13 PM


Re: The Mid East War Ramps Up
Phat writes:
Most people dont give spirits a second glance. After all, the concept is more of a vibe than an observable reality. The Holy Spirit prompts the hearts and minds of all people to forgive and reflect. You can ignore Him if you choose, but be aware that other spirits will cling on to you that you also cant see. Your behavior will herald their possible presence.
This sort of medieval fanatical talk really disheartens me. Despite, all the progress we've made since the enlightenment, it's a reminder that some people will still be mystical thinking idiots given half a chance.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London. Olen Suomi Soy Barcelona. I am Ukraine.

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 105 by Phat, posted 10-23-2023 9:13 PM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 108 by Phat, posted 10-24-2023 7:13 AM Tangle has replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9524
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 5.5


(4)
Message 109 of 377 (913336)
10-24-2023 7:38 AM
Reply to: Message 108 by Phat
10-24-2023 7:13 AM


Re: The Mid East War Ramps Up
Phat writes:
Do you see me as a mystical thinking idiot?
Take a wild guess.
Just because for you these concepts are sheer lunacy, you surely know the evidence-based psychological and sociological side of the picture. You act as if I am in the psyche ward thinking im Merlin the Magician or something!
Belief in that kind of total garbage in a modern day society IS lunacy. You're a functioning loony.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London. Olen Suomi Soy Barcelona. I am Ukraine.

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 108 by Phat, posted 10-24-2023 7:13 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9524
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 121 of 377 (913369)
10-25-2023 5:59 PM
Reply to: Message 119 by GDR
10-25-2023 5:36 PM


Re: The Mid East War Ramps Up
I see it this way
Yeh, another "I believe..." statement. Er, so what? I read the words as written and quote them back at you. What you prefer to belief despite the words written in your book by your man himself - not even the Old Testament psychotic murderer.
Matthew 12:30 “Whoever is not with me is against me, and whoever does not gather with me scatters.
31 And so I tell you, every kind of sin and slander can be forgiven, but blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven.
32 Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come.
No forgiveness. Tricky, not the heart's message is it?

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London. Olen Suomi Soy Barcelona. I am Ukraine.

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 119 by GDR, posted 10-25-2023 5:36 PM GDR has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 123 by GDR, posted 10-25-2023 6:16 PM Tangle has replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9524
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 130 of 377 (913387)
10-27-2023 2:26 AM
Reply to: Message 123 by GDR
10-25-2023 6:16 PM


Re: The Mid East War Ramps Up
GDR writes:
So it really is talking about the message of the heart.
I have no idea what a “message of the heart” is. That's just invented religious gobbledegook. But whatever it means it's irrelevant. What's in god's heart is unforgiveness
“And so I tell you, every kind of sin and slander can be forgiven, but blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven.”
That's couldn't be clearer.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London. Olen Suomi Soy Barcelona. I am Ukraine.

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 123 by GDR, posted 10-25-2023 6:16 PM GDR has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 131 by Phat, posted 10-27-2023 3:24 AM Tangle has replied
 Message 144 by GDR, posted 10-30-2023 12:31 PM Tangle has replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9524
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 5.5


(1)
Message 132 of 377 (913389)
10-27-2023 3:36 AM
Reply to: Message 131 by Phat
10-27-2023 3:24 AM


Re: The Mid East War Ramps Up
Phat writes:
Where do you think this "Spirit" dwells?
I think it dwells with the elves deep in the forests of Rivendell.
Eh? That sounds like a non-religious gobbledegook.
It is.
Some believe that God created humans. Others point out that God originates in the minds of men. Would it not make sense that unforgiveness (or forgiveness) originates in human hearts and minds?
Phat, I'm simply quoting what's written about your god in your book. That's what it says in terms. You can pretend it doesn't say what it clearly says if you like but from here, it makes you look really daft.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London. Olen Suomi Soy Barcelona. I am Ukraine.

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 131 by Phat, posted 10-27-2023 3:24 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 133 by Phat, posted 10-27-2023 6:29 AM Tangle has replied
 Message 148 by Phat, posted 11-01-2023 1:29 AM Tangle has replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9524
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 134 of 377 (913391)
10-27-2023 7:03 AM
Reply to: Message 133 by Phat
10-27-2023 6:29 AM


Re: The Mid East War Ramps Up
You believe that your book is the word of god and the 'truth, the light and the way'. So when it says this
"And so I tell you, every kind of sin and slander can be forgiven, but blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven.”
Is it not true?

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London. Olen Suomi Soy Barcelona. I am Ukraine.

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 133 by Phat, posted 10-27-2023 6:29 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 136 by Phat, posted 10-27-2023 10:27 AM Tangle has replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9524
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 138 of 377 (913395)
10-27-2023 11:23 AM
Reply to: Message 136 by Phat
10-27-2023 10:27 AM


Re: The Mid East War Ramps Up
Please, answer the bloody question.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London. Olen Suomi Soy Barcelona. I am Ukraine.

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 136 by Phat, posted 10-27-2023 10:27 AM Phat has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 139 by Theodoric, posted 10-27-2023 12:48 PM Tangle has not replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9524
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 5.5


(3)
Message 145 of 377 (913434)
10-30-2023 1:18 PM
Reply to: Message 144 by GDR
10-30-2023 12:31 PM


Re: The Mid East War Ramps Up
GDR writes:
You tell me then what it means to blaspheme the Spirit.
Well who the hell knows? It's just made up superstitious woo. But whatever it is, you can't be forgiven for it apparently. I remember being terrified of it as a good Catholic boy. It just seems to be a method of exercising coercive control of people by the religion.
Here's google's chatbot. That's pretty much the message we got taught.
To blaspheme the Holy Spirit means to speak evil of or show contempt for the work of God through the Holy Spirit. It is a serious sin that Jesus warned about in the Bible. He said that every kind of sin and slander can be forgiven, except blasphemy against the Spirit. This is because blasphemy against the Spirit is a rejection of God’s grace and salvation that he offers through the Holy Spirit.
Blasphemy against the Spirit can be understood as "a continued and persistently stubborn refusal to acknowledge God even when one knows that they should". It is not a one-time mistake or a moment of doubt, but a deliberate and hardened attitude of unbelief. As long as a person remains in this state, he or she cannot receive forgiveness from God, because they have chosen to resist and insult the very source of forgiveness.
So it looks like I'm condemned to everlasting fire. Sad.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London. Olen Suomi Soy Barcelona. I am Ukraine.

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 144 by GDR, posted 10-30-2023 12:31 PM GDR has not replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9524
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 149 of 377 (913447)
11-01-2023 3:42 AM
Reply to: Message 148 by Phat
11-01-2023 1:29 AM


Re: A Rabbit Trail About Religion and Zionism
Phat writes:
That's the only way that you can wrap your mind around my God....is in a book.
That book is the reason you have a belief. Everything you think you believe originates from that book. If nobody had bothered to write those stories and nobody compiled them, you'd believe something quite different.
You have said before that the book is the only place to encounter Him, but there have been people who have encountered Him (some even from other religions) who never read a word of the book
Nobody encounters 'Him' that hasn't already heard of 'Him'.
But once again, you're avoiding the question.
“And so I tell you, every kind of sin and slander can be forgiven, but blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven.”
Are you saying that this passage in your book is wrong or can be ignored?

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London. Olen Suomi Soy Barcelona. I am Ukraine.

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 148 by Phat, posted 11-01-2023 1:29 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 150 by Phat, posted 11-01-2023 4:17 AM Tangle has replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9524
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 151 of 377 (913449)
11-01-2023 5:02 AM
Reply to: Message 150 by Phat
11-01-2023 4:17 AM


Re: A Rabbit Trail About Religion and Zionism
Phat writes:
As for me, I have gotten angry at God (Jesus) a few times and realize that I did so.
Then you can't be forgiven and you're going to hell. According to that paragraph. Soz.
(But I'm sure you can ignore it, understanding that it's not something you need to believe is true because it's inconvenient, like having to give everything you own to the poor and follow Jesus.)

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London. Olen Suomi Soy Barcelona. I am Ukraine.

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 150 by Phat, posted 11-01-2023 4:17 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 152 by Phat, posted 11-01-2023 11:11 AM Tangle has replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9524
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 5.5


(2)
Message 154 of 377 (913454)
11-01-2023 1:12 PM
Reply to: Message 152 by Phat
11-01-2023 11:11 AM


Re: A Rabbit Trail About Religion and Zionism
Phat writes:
The only defense that I have to your assertion is that few are willing to sacrifice so much comfort to follow their (alleged) Master. Which is likely what you wanted me to realize.
I guess you just don't believe what your book says then. Welcome to our club.
Non Believers don't get off the hook either, though.
There is no hook.
The problem with you guys is that you ....well, never mind. Electing a strong progressive and moral party is as impossible as taking care of the poor.
I've no idea why that's relevant to what we're talking about, but it's true that so long as half the America population behave like selfish and immoral arseholes led by corrupt billionaires it's going to be tough.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London. Olen Suomi Soy Barcelona. I am Ukraine.

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 152 by Phat, posted 11-01-2023 11:11 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 155 by Phat, posted 11-04-2023 12:53 PM Tangle has replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9524
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 156 of 377 (913482)
11-04-2023 1:08 PM
Reply to: Message 155 by Phat
11-04-2023 12:53 PM


Re: A Rabbit Trail About Religion and Zionism
Phat writes:
Is it wrong to be skeptical?
You have the mind of a flee! Of course it's wrong to be skeptical of the Holy Spirit - that's what we're talking about remember? - it'll send you to hell. (According to your book.)

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London. Olen Suomi Soy Barcelona. I am Ukraine.

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 155 by Phat, posted 11-04-2023 12:53 PM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 157 by Phat, posted 11-04-2023 1:17 PM Tangle has replied

  
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