Understanding through Discussion


Welcome! You are not logged in. [ Login ]
EvC Forum active members: 86 (8985 total)
37 online now:
PaulK, Tangle (2 members, 35 visitors)
Newest Member: Jerry Johnson
Post Volume: Total: 877,742 Year: 9,490/23,288 Month: 505/1,544 Week: 219/561 Day: 7/38 Hour: 0/0


Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
Author Topic:   The Ark - materials, construction and seaworthness
RickJB
Member (Idle past 3543 days)
Posts: 917
From: London, UK
Joined: 04-14-2006


Message 113 of 231 (328544)
07-03-2006 12:16 PM
Reply to: Message 112 by iano
07-03-2006 12:07 PM


Re: Whatever floats your boat
iano writes:

You probably wouldn't be but I would consider my case rested.

Excuse me? You haven't got a case to rest!

I could just as well have spent the last twenty posts arguing that Noah had Warp Drive. It would be no more science fiction that what you have propoed.

If it IS God we are talking about then I propose that He gave Noah anti-gravity technology which allowed the Ark to float above the flood. Noah also had a DNA replication machine that stored the DNA sequences of every known animal and then recreated them from scratch after the flood.

Now prove me wrong!

Edited by RickJB, : No reason given.

Edited by RickJB, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 112 by iano, posted 07-03-2006 12:07 PM iano has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 115 by iano, posted 07-03-2006 12:31 PM RickJB has responded

  
RickJB
Member (Idle past 3543 days)
Posts: 917
From: London, UK
Joined: 04-14-2006


Message 116 of 231 (328552)
07-03-2006 12:45 PM
Reply to: Message 114 by iano
07-03-2006 12:30 PM


Re: Whatever floats your boat
iano writes:

With Noah we have no idea as to his means.

...because he is a character in a mythical story! His "means" are irrelevent to technology, archaeology and history because they provide no evidence.

We don't know Santa's "means", do we? Can you tell me how Santa's sleigh is able to float?

A lack of evidence doesn't demonstrate your case, it simply makes all your assumptions utterly baseless. The evidence we DO have totally discounts the entire myth.

Like others have said to Faith, the honest position for you to take on this is just to argue that "Goddidit" and not attempt to bend science, history and archaeology to fit your faith.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 114 by iano, posted 07-03-2006 12:30 PM iano has not yet responded

  
RickJB
Member (Idle past 3543 days)
Posts: 917
From: London, UK
Joined: 04-14-2006


Message 119 of 231 (328555)
07-03-2006 12:59 PM
Reply to: Message 115 by iano
07-03-2006 12:31 PM


Re: Whatever floats your boat
iano writes:

I have "wood and intelligence". This is consistant with what we might suppose of his times.

Iron use has been found as early as 4000 BC in Sumer, so why
did it take humans till victorian times to build steam engines? I mean, the Sumerians had "iron and intelligence" didn't they?

Technology advances through the accumulation of knowledge, the raw materials alone don't demonstrate your case. Invention aside, one also needs a suitable social infrastructure to take on large, technically diffcult projects - manpower to build, to source materials and to feed workers, for example.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 115 by iano, posted 07-03-2006 12:31 PM iano has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 120 by Percy, posted 07-03-2006 1:15 PM RickJB has not yet responded

  
RickJB
Member (Idle past 3543 days)
Posts: 917
From: London, UK
Joined: 04-14-2006


Message 208 of 231 (331363)
07-13-2006 2:18 AM
Reply to: Message 207 by iano
07-12-2006 8:07 PM


Re: i'm staying off your bridges
Nice diversion, Iano!

So, how many animals were on the ark?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 207 by iano, posted 07-12-2006 8:07 PM iano has not yet responded

  
RickJB
Member (Idle past 3543 days)
Posts: 917
From: London, UK
Joined: 04-14-2006


Message 211 of 231 (331382)
07-13-2006 7:00 AM
Reply to: Message 209 by riVeRraT
07-13-2006 6:18 AM


riverrat writes:

Tell me, what is the difference between coming up with a theory that a tomb exists in Egypt somewhere, and searching for it, and coming with a theory that the earth and everything in it was created by a God, and searching for the proof?

We know the Egyptians (as well as other cultures) build tombs. We have observed them. Given that tombs are a known feature of human culture in general, one can hypothesize about their existence.

Same goes for the old SETI argument. Humanity is one known example in the universe of a civilization with communications technology based around electromagnetism. There *might* be others, although the chances of finding them are very slim. Only a tiny fraction of available research budgets go anywhere near this field.

No one, on the other hand, has ever observed God or intelligent design. Nor does any of the evidence gathered point to it.

Now, one might argue (as Iano has) that we can use Human design as some kind of guide, but as we have no scientific evidence for God himself we have no grounds on which to make assumptions about his design methods.

Edited by RickJB, : No reason given.

Edited by RickJB, : No reason given.

Edited by RickJB, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 209 by riVeRraT, posted 07-13-2006 6:18 AM riVeRraT has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 212 by riVeRraT, posted 07-13-2006 7:31 AM RickJB has responded

  
RickJB
Member (Idle past 3543 days)
Posts: 917
From: London, UK
Joined: 04-14-2006


Message 216 of 231 (331422)
07-13-2006 9:32 AM
Reply to: Message 212 by riVeRraT
07-13-2006 7:31 AM


riverrat writes:

This is a better example than what I gave, thank you.

There is absolutely no evidence of aliens, only subjective, yet we search for them. According to calculations and odds, we shouldn't even exist in this universe. So, doesn't that make it bad science to waste time looking for aliens?

:rolleyes:

I posted a refutation of this comment before you even made it!!

There IS evidence of intelligent life having arisen in the universe - humanity! As for odds, we cannot truly know given that we have a sample pool of exactly one. Looking for life out in the universe gives us a bigger sample and a means to properly answer such a question...

riverat writes:

It may be subjective, but everything we view in life is through our subjective minds.

Which is why science seeks to establish "objective reality" by means of repeatable experimentation carried out by a multitude of individuals.

Your "subjective reality" doesn't, for example, change how a TV works!

riverrat writes:

If you ever experienced what I have experienced from God, you would think differently...

Well I haven't, so I won't.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 212 by riVeRraT, posted 07-13-2006 7:31 AM riVeRraT has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 219 by riVeRraT, posted 07-13-2006 10:11 AM RickJB has responded

  
RickJB
Member (Idle past 3543 days)
Posts: 917
From: London, UK
Joined: 04-14-2006


Message 222 of 231 (331497)
07-13-2006 12:43 PM
Reply to: Message 219 by riVeRraT
07-13-2006 10:11 AM


riverrat writes:

That is not a rebuttal to what I said. I said there is no proof of aliens. That means life foreign to our own.

"Alien" is a relative term. SETI searches for extra-terrestrial *intelligence*. We are a (reasonably!) intelligent civilization. There may be others.

There is, as yet, no real evidence for any "intelligent" civilization except ourselves, but our very existence demonstrates that it CAN exist. The SETI hypothesis has a clear foundation.

God's very existence, on the other hand, has not been established.

Edited by RickJB, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 219 by riVeRraT, posted 07-13-2006 10:11 AM riVeRraT has not yet responded

  
Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2018 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.0 Beta
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2020