Register | Sign In


Understanding through Discussion


EvC Forum active members: 66 (9164 total)
6 online now:
Newest Member: ChatGPT
Post Volume: Total: 916,471 Year: 3,728/9,624 Month: 599/974 Week: 212/276 Day: 52/34 Hour: 2/1


Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
Author Topic:   Is Anything Evil? Does Evil Exist?
Phat
Member
Posts: 18310
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 11 of 105 (398720)
05-02-2007 10:52 AM
Reply to: Message 9 by Rob
05-02-2007 10:24 AM


Worldviews and Creation/Evolution
Rob writes:
Perhpas you can begin to perceive how interrelated these recent posts of mine are. I hope someone catches the Spirit of it, for it's purposes are honest and pure.
Rob,in my thread writes:
And that has been my most difficult struggle; to realize that I cannot persuade anyone. That the truth is nonsense to them. It absolutely kills me, and seems so unfair...
But are you sure that the truth is nonsense to Percy? I do not see him as an unwitting tool of Satan...after all, were it not for him, you and I would not be able to have a soapbox for Gods cause!
Belief in evolution tends to produce worldviews that say that humans are a product of their environment (nature)
Belief in a Creator tends to produce worldviews that say that humans are a product of their decisions (nurture)
Does that make any sense? If humans were evil by nature, evil would be natural and God would be a human construct or a reality that everyone will face one way or another.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by Rob, posted 05-02-2007 10:24 AM Rob has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 35 by Rob, posted 05-03-2007 12:47 AM Phat has not replied

Phat
Member
Posts: 18310
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 60 of 105 (398950)
05-03-2007 5:03 AM
Reply to: Message 53 by Rob
05-03-2007 2:17 AM


Re: Still falling short
Gregory Koukl is a Christian Apologist who has a unique perspective on Evil that you may find interesting, Rob. It is relevant to this topic because it comes from the worldview of a creationist.
The full article can be found here.
In a nutshell, what the crux of his argument is is this:
STR writes:
The first step in answering the problem of evil is this: We've got to get clear on what this thing "evil" actually is. It does seem to follow that if God created all things, and evil is a thing, then God created evil. This is a valid syllogism. If the premises are true, then the conclusion would be true as well.
The problem with that line of reasoning is that the second premise is not true. Evil is not a thing. The person who probably explained it best was St. Augustine, and then Thomas Aquinas picked up on his solution. Others since them have argued that evil has no ontological status in itself.
Let me give you an illustration to make this more clear. We talk about things being cold or warm. But coldness is not a thing that exists in itself; it has no ontological status. Coldness is the absence of heat. When we remove heat energy from a system, we say it gets colder.
"Cold" isn't a thing. It's a way of describing the reduction of molecular activity resulting in the sensation of heat. So the more heat we pull out of a system, the colder it gets. Cold itself isn't being "created." Cold is a description of a circumstance in which heat is missing. Heat is energy which can be measured. When you remove heat, the temperature goes down. We call that condition "cold," but there is no cold "stuff" that causes that condition.
Same thing with a shadow. Shadows don't exist as things in themselves; they're just the absence of light.
Evil is like that. Evil isn't like some black, gooey stuff floating around the universe that gloms onto people and causes them to do awful things. Evil is the absence of good, a privation of good, not a thing in itself.
So donut holes don't exist; they're just the absence of donut. Shadows don't exist; they're just the absence of light. And evil doesn't exist; it's just the absence of good.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 53 by Rob, posted 05-03-2007 2:17 AM Rob has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 63 by Rob, posted 05-03-2007 9:15 AM Phat has not replied

Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2023 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.2
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2024