EvC Forum: Pagan origins of the bible stories

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Topic: Pagan origins of the bible stories

Rrhain

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Message 16 of 20 (60701)
10-13-2003 7:35 AM

Reply to: Message 7 by Pringlesguy7
10-10-2003 2:37 PM

Re: here ya go

Pringlesguy7 responds to me:

quote:
if you know who wrote the first 5 books of the Bible

That's just it. We have no idea who wrote them.

Oh, the tradition is that Moses wrote them, but we know that is physically impossible. Deuteronomy contains a description of Moses' funeral, so we know that at least some of the Pentateuch was written by somebody other than Moses.

And given that Moses doesn't seem to have ever existed, we are left with the conclusion that some anonymous authors wrote it.

quote:
And how do you know if the other accounts are closer?

Because they came earlier. They are closer to the event, therefore they are more likely to be correct. That doesn't mean that they are right. After all, an earlier fictional account is still a fictional account. However, given that a great amount of the Old Testament is plagiaraized Babylonian mythology, if any of these sources are going to be accurate, it isn't going to be the Bible.

Question: Which is more likely to be the most accurate version of a story...the original or the translation?

I personally think that it is possible to make a perfect translation (difficult, but possible), but the question is which is more likely to be the most accurate version?

Since the Bible appears to be translated stories, how much validity should we give to them as being the most accurate?

Of course, the oldest extant culture are the Aborigines in Australia, going back 60,000 years, and their mythology looks nothing like what the Bible says.

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Rrhain
WWJD? JWRTFM!

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	Message 7 by Pringlesguy7, posted 10-10-2003 2:37 PM		Pringlesguy7 has not replied

Replies to this message:
	Message 17 by Dr Jack, posted 10-13-2003 7:59 AM		Rrhain has replied

Dr Jack

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Message 17 of 20 (60704)
10-13-2003 7:59 AM

Reply to: Message 16 by Rrhain
10-13-2003 7:35 AM

Re: here ya go

Of course, the oldest extant culture are the Aborigines in Australia, going back 60,000 years, and their mythology looks nothing like what the Bible says.

This isn't awfully relevant, but I thought it was 35,000 years, do you have a source for 60,000?

This message is a reply to:
	Message 16 by Rrhain, posted 10-13-2003 7:35 AM		Rrhain has replied

Replies to this message:
	Message 18 by Rrhain, posted 10-13-2003 9:06 AM		Dr Jack has replied

Rrhain

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Posts: 6351

From: San Diego, CA, USA

Joined: 05-03-2003

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Message 18 of 20 (60710)
10-13-2003 9:06 AM

Reply to: Message 17 by Dr Jack
10-13-2003 7:59 AM

Re: here ya go

Mr Jack responds to me:

quote:
This isn't awfully relevant, but I thought it was 35,000 years, do you have a source for 60,000?

Not a very good one, alas.

I recently received a junk mail advertising tours in Australia. Some of the tours include exhibitions at Aboriginal culture centers and the brochure claims that they are 60,000 years old.

The following web site also claims 60,000:

Australian Aboriginal Culture

Recent dating of the earliest known archaeological sites on the Australian continent - using thermo-luminescence and other modern dating techniques - have pushed back the date for Aboriginal presence in Australia to at least 40,000 years. Some of the evidence points to dates over 60,000 years old.

Then there's this one:

Indigenous Australia

Archaeological investigations in the northwest of Australia suggest that Indigenous people may have occupied Australia for at least 60,000 years.

I will be happy to knock it down to 35,000. That's still an order of magnitude more than Judaism and is more than twice as old as Hinduism.

------------------
Rrhain
WWJD? JWRTFM!

This message is a reply to:
	Message 17 by Dr Jack, posted 10-13-2003 7:59 AM		Dr Jack has replied

Replies to this message:
	Message 19 by Dr Jack, posted 10-13-2003 9:11 AM		Rrhain has not replied

Dr Jack

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Posts: 3514

From: Immigrant in the land of Deutsch

Joined: 07-14-2003

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Message 19 of 20 (60712)
10-13-2003 9:11 AM

Reply to: Message 18 by Rrhain
10-13-2003 9:06 AM

Re: here ya go

I will be happy to knock it down to 35,000. That's still an order of magnitude more than Judaism and is more than twice as old as Hinduism.

Yes, there's little doubt that the Aborigines have the oldest continous culture in the world.

This message is a reply to:
	Message 18 by Rrhain, posted 10-13-2003 9:06 AM		Rrhain has not replied

Replies to this message:
	Message 20 by Coragyps, posted 10-13-2003 1:30 PM		Dr Jack has not replied

Coragyps

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Message 20 of 20 (60726)
10-13-2003 1:30 PM

Reply to: Message 19 by Dr Jack
10-13-2003 9:11 AM

Re: here ya go

Or a compromise: Nature 421, 837 - 840 (20 February 2003):

Australia's oldest human remains, found at Lake Mungo, include the world's oldest ritual ochre burial (Mungo III) and the first recorded cremation (Mungo I). Until now, the importance of these finds has been constrained by limited chronologies and palaeoenvironmental information. Mungo III, the source of the world's oldest human mitochondrial DNA, has been variously estimated at 30 thousand years (kyr) old, 42—45 kyr old and 62 6 kyr old, while radiocarbon estimates placed the Mungo I cremation near 20—26 kyr ago. Here we report a new series of 25 optical ages showing that both burials occurred at 40 2 kyr ago and that humans were present at Lake Mungo by 50—46 kyr ago, synchronously with, or soon after, initial occupation of northern and western Australia. Stratigraphic evidence indicates fluctuations between lake-full and drier conditions from 50 to 40 kyr ago, simultaneously with increased dust deposition, human arrival and continent-wide extinction of the megafauna. This was followed by sustained aridity between 40 and 30 kyr ago. This new chronology corrects previous estimates for human burials at this important site and provides a new picture of Homo sapiens adapting to deteriorating climate in the world's driest inhabited continent.

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	Message 19 by Dr Jack, posted 10-13-2003 9:11 AM		Dr Jack has not replied

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