Evolutionarily Drawn to Nature?

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder they say ... Curiously I just came back from two weeks in Puerto Rico, where 80° was common, and staying in resort hotels.Today we had 2" of snow and it was wonderful to be back where people had weather ... I too used to be a boy scout, and then a scout leader, and my favorite campouts have all been winter campouts with snow. Nothing like sleeping out under the stars in a -40° bag laying on top of the snow (I tend to be a minimalist LNT camper).Enjoy.Edited by RAZD, : ,Edited by RAZD, : -

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we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
Rebel American Zen Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.

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I have to agree with that one too onfire. My best hotel experience was getting paid by the Navy to stay at the five star Gulf Hotel in Bahrain. Talk about opulance. The bed was bigger was almost like two california kings side by side. I am 5'10" and I could lay across the width of the bed with arms outstretched and not touch either side of the bed. Also the dining was out of this world. I must of gained 20 lbs eating at a different restaurant inside the hotel every night: american food, japanes, chinese, international buffet and a english pub. Plus a fabulous pool to boot. Some of the best 30 days of my single life.

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For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring.
Dr. Carl Sagan

Hi, Yetman. Welcome to EvC! I don't think it sounds all that beneficial to become entranced by pretty things around you. To me, it sounds like more of a distraction that allows predators or enemies to sneak up on you than a way to memorize the landscape. It seems more logical to me that a habitat-familiarity mechanism would be successful if it caused us to be attracted to things that are directly beneficial for our survival, like food, water and shelter, and not to flowers, butterflies and flames.-----I also wonder if it's not simple projection of a personal perspective onto the entire human species at large (Larni: what do they call that?). Without having actually done a poll, I'm pretty sure a large chunk of people I know don't really care for nature, so I'm hesitant to accept the premise of your thesis that people are innately drawn to nature.I personally love nature (and campfires): I particularly like collecting bugs. But, I don't think I have personally felt a pleasure sensor tripping at the sight of nature without some sort of prior preparation or build-up. I also grew up as a city boy, and didn't ever get involved in nature until Boy Scouts, and, even then, it took me awhile to work up to enjoyment. So, to me, it seemed like more of an acquired taste.So, that's one vote against the argument for an innate love of nature in humans. Take it for what it's worth. But I, personally, have a hard time assigning evolutionary significance to a trait that's not universal, or for which I'm not sure there is evidence that it's even particularly common.

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-BluejayDarwin loves you.

Bluejay,

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Hi, Yetman. Welcome to EvC!

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Hello and thanks very much.

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I don't think it sounds all that beneficial to become entranced by pretty things around you. To me, it sounds like more of a distraction that allows predators or enemies to sneak up on you than a way to memorize the landscape.

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I think it would actually be an advantage against predators. Looking around, observing the environment closely would increase detection of potential predators, as well as instill a familiarity with the landscape.

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It seems more logical to me that a habitat-familiarity mechanism would be successful if it caused us to be attracted to things that are directly beneficial for our survival, like food, water and shelter, and not to flowers, butterflies and flames.

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We do have mechanisms for those necessities: hunger, thirst, and discomfort. In order to satisfy those needs, we'll need to know where to find the resources. For that very reason it's important to be familiar with the environment. This is why I believe we have evolved to enjoy observing natural scenery. If we're familiar with our territory, we'll know exactly where to find food, water, and shelter, and we'll know the best routes for travel or escape, thus increasing our chances of survival.

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I also wonder if it's not simple projection of a personal perspective onto the entire human species at large (Larni: what do they call that?). Without having actually done a poll, I'm pretty sure a large chunk of people I know don't really care for nature, so I'm hesitant to accept the premise of your thesis that people are innately drawn to nature.

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I haven't taken a poll either, and if a study has been done I would be interested in the results for sure. But from personal experience, I think typically people consider viewing a picture of natural scenery to be relaxing.

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So, that's one vote against the argument for an innate love of nature in humans. Take it for what it's worth. But I, personally, have a hard time assigning evolutionary significance to a trait that's not universal, or for which I'm not sure there is evidence that it's even particularly common.

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I don't think a study has been done to test if the trait is universal. It may not be, but I'm proposing that, for the most part, it is. I do think that looking at a picture of natural scenery is somewhat relaxing to most everyone, and more so when experienced firsthand. I think we have evolved to enjoy looking at natural scenery because of its survival benefits.

I think it depends on the experiences you had in the past as well. If you are stuck out in the wilderness during a blizzard or intense rainstorm you are not going to be relaxed and composed or "enjoying the scenery" (at least I wasn't), most likely you will be cursing yourself out for being so stupid to be out there. I also agree that it comes down to meeting your primordial needs of food, shelter, and other necessities first. Only after these are met do we attatch our emotions to things we would consider pleasurable i.e. traveling, meeting new people, walking in the woods, looking at a beuatiful painting, etc.If your experiences in the past with nature for the most part have been pleasurable (spending time with family, etc) than most likely seeing a picture of nature will be relaxing to you, if on the other hand you never had good experiences out in nature than it would be the other way around. Some people can cope with nature better than others. It just depends on your outlook on nature and life in general.

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For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring.
Dr. Carl Sagan

Of course, the basic needs always come first. If you had shelter you might've enjoyed the scenery regardless of the weather. I think if you had a traumatic experience somewhere in nature, you might develop a negative association with that specific place or very similar places. That association works to your advantage to increase your chances of survival. You'll know to avoid that place because it might be dangerous. If you viewed a picture of that place, you would remember that experience and that would affect your feelings. But that probably wouldn't change your feelings toward natural scenery as a whole. I think if you look at a picture of some natural scenery, even if it is totally unfamiliar with you, you'll instinctually feel some level of relaxation, regardless of past experience.

Hi RAZD, Not that waking up to snow isn't beautiful, it is, but im Cuban raised in Miami, we aren't a people who are fond of the cold for too long. No doubt that camping is only enjoyed in cool/cold weather. I don't know if I'd enjoy laying on top of snow but, I can appreciate the peaceful beauty of it.I too am a LNT style camper.

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"All great truths begin as blasphemies""I smoke pot. If this bothers anyone, I suggest you look around at the world in which we live and shut your mouth."--Bill Hicks"I never knew there was another option other than to question everything"--Noam Chomsky

Hi DA, One of the comics I know is part of Comedy Centrals "The Watch List"...That Page Does Not Exist! Error 404 | Comedy Central US)...and they frequently perform in Dubai(and all over the Middle East too). He told me the Middle East has some of the finest hotels in the world. 7 Star hotels! I took a look at the link to the one you stayed at, looks amazing. Isn't it amazing that a species who evolved outdoors takes so much pleasure indoors?And, yea, I bet it was an amazing experience as a single man in such luxurious settings. Edited by onifre, : No reason given.

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"All great truths begin as blasphemies""I smoke pot. If this bothers anyone, I suggest you look around at the world in which we live and shut your mouth."--Bill Hicks"I never knew there was another option other than to question everything"--Noam Chomsky

I think the 7 star hotel you are talking about is theBurj Al Arab in Dubai.
I have been to Dubai and Jubel Ali in the United Arab Emirates about 4 or 5 times and it never ceases to amaze me the granduer of these cities. They are litteraly built straight up from the sands of the desert surround them. No grass, very few trees, and construction all over the place. The Burj Al Arab is on a peninnsula which can only be accessed through a gated area in which you have to pay somewhere around $10-$20 to go through the gate even to take a look in the lobby (they won't let you unless you are in a suit or the arab thawb. I was flabergasted when I saw a helicopter land on the helo pad at the top of the hotel. The arabs of UAE have more money than they know what to do with.Actually some of the richest people on earth try to marry these two seemingly diametrically opposed forms of relaxation: nature and oppulant hotels. Case in point are the resorts of the Caribbean.Edited by DevilsAdvocate, : No reason given.

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For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring.
Dr. Carl Sagan

by natural scenery do you mean pictures of mountains and forests and rivers and the like, or is it more your home region, maybe the mainstreet, or familiar areas?

There are few better pleasures in life than being warm and dry in a bag in the midst of extreme elements Then again, there is always that moment of waking in a bag and realising that goretex will not prevent a newly formed river from flowing through your bag

,That would never happen at the Ritz Carlton. Then again, I've seen some crazy things happen in hotels so I guess there's an equal trade off.

Happened to me back in the late 50's, before tents had floors and mosquito netting, back when scouts "ditched" around their tents - which we had not done. The other scout in the tent is still a best friend.I've been careful since (or lucky).Enjoy.

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we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
Rebel American Zen Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.

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• • • Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click) • • •

Although I never had a problem in a sleeping bag, 2 guys in a military unit I was evaluating, pitched their 2 Man pup-tent on a slight downgrade. Late that night a thunderstorm hit and the area they were in became a wash. They, in their sleeping bags became projectiles down the slope and into the stream at the bottom of the hill. Cold & wet awakening.

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There is no better love between 2 people than mutual respect for each other WT Young, 2002Who gave anyone the authority to call me an authority on anything. WT Young, 1969

Yeah, I mean places that resemble natural environment, whether viewed in person or in photograph.