Well, yes, but that post wasn't what I had in mind when I mentioned derogatory comments. Anyway, in case others are having the same difficulties I am, since I don't really understand Viv's position, I don't understand the rebuttal, either. For example, it isn't apparent to me how light scattering light relates to the speed of light, the thread's topic.
It shouldn't go without saying that your technical contributions on relativity and cosmological topics are invaluable.
However, I would insist on such discussions being conducted in the proper, dignified language of old-style true rational Science, not of the idiotic, clever-clever yob-culture which is all too often a feature of some of these forums nowadays.
At EvC Forum participants do not set or enforce the rules of debate. These are laid out in our Forum Guidelines, and they are enforced by the moderators.
Thanks for the thoughtful reply. Here at EvC Forum we try very hard to keep discussion focused on and around the thread's topic, and try to discourage significant departures. Discussions that have run their course do not turn to other topics. Instead, participants are encouraged to propose new topics over at Proposed New Topics regarding related issues that come up.
Viv essentially has three topics that he would like to discuss.
Issues related in some way to the speed of light, which are appropriate for this thread.
Science's philosophical wrong turn, for which a new thread should be proposed.
Viv's heretical status within science, for which a new thread should also be proposed.
Staying on topic doesn't mean that every sentence or paragraph must be on topic. Short diversions, personal asides and interjections are a normal part of any discussion. Moderators only try to step in when significant departures from topic occur. And members who demonstrate a penchant for going off-topic tend to get more attention from moderators.
By the way, threads in the Coffee House forum are not moderated as closely as the more focused science or religion threads, and you can begin topics there yourself without going through the topic proposal process. Viv's experiences as a scientific heretic might be appropriate there.
It would make it easier to moderate this thread if you could yourself refrain from making "fightin' words" type of comments, like, "I can’t see any reason other than that it is frightening you." When those on both sides of an issue are ignoring the Forum Guidelines (it doesn't hurt to give them a read) it makes it difficult for moderators.
There is, however, the fact that some people are simply infuriated by any sggestion that there may be omething they don't already know.
I think many find nothing more infuriating that being accused of disagreeing with you because they are infuriated to discover they don't know everything. Could you please refrain from making these kinds of characterizations, or any kinds of characterizations at all about your partners in discussion? They are not the topic, and it distracts a great deal from the topic of discussion.
Also, please stop answering queries by referring people to where they can find the answer. If you've truly already provided the information in this thread then just link to it, e.g., [msg=-166]. If the answer lies elsewhere on the web then please answer the question and provide links as supporting references.
Is there ANYONE on this forum with the nous and the nerve to understand what I am saying?
This is unhelpful, off-topic, personal, and definitely not what we're looking for at EvC Forum. The people you're discussing with are not the topic of discussion. If you want to have a topic discussing what a bunch of noodniks participate at EvC Forum then open a topic over at the Coffee House, but in this thread you will focus on the topic, and if you don't then, as I'm doing now, you will be suspended for 24 hours. See you tomorrow.
feel that your caution to me about ‘fighting words’ and so on is misplaced.
Look, Viv, you're beginning to take up a lot of moderation time, so allow me to be blunt. I did, earlier, care what you think, but given your behavior you have taken this to the point where what you think does not matter. I was willing to work with you, but you seem determined to go your own way no matter what moderators say, so now I'm going to be blunt.
It doesn't matter that you think my caution to you about "fightin' words" is misplaced. I'm the moderator who will suspend you if you ignore him, so I suggest you take my caution seriously.
You can follow moderator requests to focus on the topic and not on the thread's participants, or you will be suspended for 24 hours.
You can start offering answers instead of evasions to questions, or you will be suspended for 24 hours.
You can start following moderator requests, or you will be suspended for 24 hours.
And about this:
Viv Pope writes:
So we can forget about your cautionary remarks on that. I was in no way meaning to report discussion problems. I am well capable of handling these myself (Sorry for the mistake!).
Do not take moderation issues into your own hands or you will be suspended for 24 hours.