I`ve always admired the old-timers here for their endless patience and tenacity. No sooner do they explain an allegation away (and at some considerable length), than the fool factory sends a new generation here with the same idiotic claim. The mind-set of the invader isn`t to learn, but to defeat the evilutionist with impeccable logic. And with god`s backing, how can he/she fail? How is she/he to know the ammunition is flawed. After all it SOUNDS right. Even the title of our forum speaks of confrontation--evolution VERSUS creation. So they come here not to learn, but to slay the dragon. And when the plan comes apart, they predictably use the fall-back line--'You`ll go to hell'. Or variations of it.
Judo teaches us not to oppose force with force (although I wish a few Black Belts would remember that), but to use your opponent's strength against himself. Maybe, instead of resisting fundies with the full majesty of our righteous knowledge, we should agree with them, then suggest we improve their argument by making it impregnable by tidying up the weak points. On the journey, we can white-ant his/her beliefs until the penny drops. Or not, as the case may be. :D
Judo teaches us not to oppose force with force (although I wish a few Black Belts would remember that), but to use your opponent's strength against himself. Maybe, instead of resisting fundies with the full majesty of our righteous knowledge, we should agree with them, then suggest we improve their argument by making it impregnable by tidying up the weak points.
I tried that with Percy and Nosy. Let em state their case, even agree with the correct points, and then ask the question which exposes the weak link and point of tension. But they only became confused and wished it away.
By the way, Jesus also said not to resist an evil person (I'm having difficulty learning the discipline). But He did know how to use thier own words against them by asking the proper question and revealing the false assumptions.
I personally reccommend that all of you continue to talk down to us 'fundies'. It is what character building is made of. When I am no longer offended, I will have mastered the discipline.
Ignorance and superstition will almost always trump science and reason. It's ever so much easier to swallow.
Winning a debate is one thing. Winning a straw poll is another. I wasn't talking about the latter.
The debate is in the bag. You hold all the trumps. But a partisan audience is a partisan audience.
Whether the debate is Science versus Pseudoscience or Republicans versus Democrats or Coke versus Pepsi or PC versus Mac--if you're talking to a roomful of people who have already decided they're for one side of the thing, you won't win the straw poll. There aren't enough undecided voters in the room to manage it. If you sway them all you still come in under 50%. The decided voters won't budge. Not in one day, anyway.
Talk to the audience anyway, for all the reasons I said. Accept that you're talking to a partisan crowd with all the rights and privileges thereunto pertaining--then go in and do what you can. You have reality on your side. It's still the best opportunity they will have to hear an unfiltered presentation about science and how it works.
Reality is bigger than one audience. Talk to those undecideds in the room who are afraid to say out loud that they are undecided. They are always there. They aren't saying much, but they are listening.
I'll take you word for it. But I don't have a clue as to what you mean. If your religion taught you that, then your religion is evil, too. I am not religious, and I don't believe I am evil. I am not perfect, either. If I ever chose to join a religion, it would have three tenets: 1) nothing is naturally evil, and everything is natural; 2) God (or Big Black Mambo Mamma, et al.) blessed me with a chance to participate in nature, and what I can or cannot do with this opportunity in ENTIRELY up to me; and 3) there is only ONE "heaven," which is more properly referred to as "Earth's biosphere"—'ashes to ashes, dust to dust'. That's all.
Most evil people think they're one of the good guys. How do you know you're not one of the people Jesus was talking about?
That is the question isn't it?
I few months ago you mentioned firearms (ownership and specification) in a way to intimidate a fellow poster here. That went a long way to answering some questions. I would have canned your ass right there because I wondering just how stable you are.
I already know I am an evil person. It is you who need to see yourself as you really are. Even that makes no sense to you in your tower of righteousness. So that is how I know.
Can i add, one with a really big persecution complex?
As far as self-imagined righteousness, you take top honors. You keep on spouting off like you are walking lock step with your buddy Jesus.
It failed because the hearer has no ears to hear or eyes to see.
Of course you end with the very point to make my case of your false sense of righteousness and superiority.
Edited by iceage, : Now just where are those rolling eye's emoticon