Register | Sign In


Understanding through Discussion


EvC Forum active members: 65 (9162 total)
3 online now:
Newest Member: popoi
Post Volume: Total: 915,806 Year: 3,063/9,624 Month: 908/1,588 Week: 91/223 Day: 2/17 Hour: 0/0


Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
Author Topic:   A Working Definition of God
sidelined
Member (Idle past 5907 days)
Posts: 3435
From: Edmonton Alberta Canada
Joined: 08-30-2003


Message 23 of 332 (200308)
04-19-2005 7:26 AM
Reply to: Message 22 by Faith
04-19-2005 12:13 AM


Faith
Is it at all a possibility that there really are invisible beings about which there is no way to point to evidence other than witness evidence or testimonies of personal experience?
In order to make sense of this sentence you must allow for two mutually exclusive assumptions.You are telling us that there were witnesses and you also say there are invisible beings who,by nature of being invisible,cannot be witnessed.
If we allow that these people saw the entities then this means that their eyes reponded to an electromagnetic impulse in the visible light range and thus these entities can indeed be independently corroborated.
If we allow that these entities are invisible then explain how they make their presence known to people visibly.

And since you know you cannot see yourself,
so well as by reflection, I, your glass,
will modestly discover to yourself,
that of yourself which you yet know not of

This message is a reply to:
 Message 22 by Faith, posted 04-19-2005 12:13 AM Faith has not replied

sidelined
Member (Idle past 5907 days)
Posts: 3435
From: Edmonton Alberta Canada
Joined: 08-30-2003


Message 259 of 332 (201564)
04-23-2005 7:58 PM
Reply to: Message 257 by Faith
04-23-2005 6:52 PM


Re: Real physical events may not leave physical evidence
Faith
The independent corroborating evidence is the witness reports of the Old Testament
Really?Which report is correct?
Gen.4:12 "A fugitive and a vagabond shalt thou be in the earth."
Gen.4:17
"And Cain knew his wife, and she conceived, ... and he builded a city."
Oh, no! Seven days before the flood.
Gen.7:7-10
And Noah went in, and his sons, and his wife, and his sons' wives with him, into the ark.... And it came to pass after seven days, that the waters of the flood were upon the earth
The same day as the flood! Which report is correct? Come to think of it who would have been left to record except for Noah and family?{Wouldn't you think that they would get it right?}
Gen.7:11-13
In the six hundredth year of Noah's life, in the second month, the seventeenth day of the month, the same day were all the fountains of the great deep broken up, and the windows of heaven were opened. And the rain was upon the earth forty days and forty nights. In the selfsame day entered Noah, and Shem, and Ham, and Japheth, the sons of Noah, and Noah's wife, and the three wives of his sons with them, into the ark.
Is incest forbidden?
Lev.18:12 "Thou shalt not uncover the nakedness of thy father's sister."
Or shall you?
Ex.6:20
"And Amram took him Jochebed his father's sister to wife; and she bare him Aaron and Moses."
Who proofreads this stuff?WITHIN THE SAME BOOK.
Ex.20:13,
"Thou shalt not kill."
Ex.32:27
"Thus saith the Lord God of Israel, Put every man his sword by his side ... and slay every man his brother, and every man his companion, and every man his neighbor."
You must have a different definition of corroborating than me.

And since you know you cannot see yourself,
so well as by reflection, I, your glass,
will modestly discover to yourself,
that of yourself which you yet know not of

This message is a reply to:
 Message 257 by Faith, posted 04-23-2005 6:52 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 277 by Faith, posted 04-24-2005 2:40 AM sidelined has replied

sidelined
Member (Idle past 5907 days)
Posts: 3435
From: Edmonton Alberta Canada
Joined: 08-30-2003


Message 283 of 332 (201683)
04-24-2005 10:00 AM
Reply to: Message 277 by Faith
04-24-2005 2:40 AM


Re: Real physical events may not leave physical evidence
Faith
Faith writes:
I found your post nearly incoherent. You make assertions you give no clear evidence for,
I apologize,the fault is mine.Iforgot to attribute the opening quote to you in that last post of mine.Allow mw to correct this.
Faith writes:
The independent corroborating evidence is the witness reports of the Old Testament
I then gave you these 4 examples of independent evidence of witnesses that do not corroborate.
Gen.4:12 "A fugitive and a vagabond shalt thou be in the earth."
Gen.4:17
"And Cain knew his wife, and she conceived, ... and he builded a city."
A fugitive who built a city? Within 5 verses the fortunes of Cain are completely turned around.Someone is mistaken here and you can choose whichever since the witness reports are not in sync and thus are poor evidence indeed.
There is more.Since you missed it the first time I will repeat myself.
Gen.7:7-10
And Noah went in, and his sons, and his wife, and his sons' wives with him, into the ark.... AND IT CAME TO PASS AFTER SEVEN DAYS, that the waters of the flood were upon the earth
Gen.7:11-13
In the six hundredth year of Noah's life, in the second month, the seventeenth day of the month, the same day were all the fountains of the great deep broken up, and the windows of heaven were opened. And the rain was upon the earth forty days and forty nights. IN THE SELFSAME DAY entered Noah, and Shem, and Ham, and Japheth, the sons of Noah, and Noah's wife, and the three wives of his sons with them, into the ark.
As I mentioned before the only witness that could have been available for these news items must have been aboard the ark and they still do not corroborate one another.
Let us carry on. Next we have these 2 verses.It concerns incest.
Lev.18:12 "Thou shalt not uncover the nakedness of thy father's sister
This of course must not have been a problem for Moses father.
Ex.6:20
"And Amram took him Jochebed his father's sister to wife; and she bare him Aaron and Moses."
Perhaps they were really special people though and as such exempt from such trivial taboos such as incest.
And,for the purpose of this post on corrborating eveidence of witnesses we have this.
Ex.20:13,
"Thou shalt not kill."
Ex.32:27
"Thus saith the Lord God of Israel, Put every man his sword by his side ... and slay every man his brother, and every man his companion, and every man his neighbor."
Would this be what you were referring to when you said in your present post and I quote
Faith writes:
And like many confused people these days you can't tell the difference between the murder of innocents and justice done to the guilty.
WTF? What were they guilty of these 3000 people? What was the inconceivable evil that they had commited that could only be rewarded by their slaughter by sword.Do you even engage your brain when you read this stuff?Do you not contemplate the horror of a death by sword? It is not instantaneous at the best of times.
LOL!! And these were to people they knew.If you find this holy in someway I bet Jonestown must have been thrilling for you.Where do you lose the inconsistency of the COMMANDMENT that shall not kill and the passage that allows for the slaughter of 3000? Does it mean thou shall not kill sometimes?
I think I am not the one confused here friend.
Faith writes:
You seem surprised to find people violating God's laws, as if you expected them all to be pure rather than the sinners they all were, like all of us
If the man who conversed with your bloody god,{an appropriate adjective{adverb?} don't you think?} and who brought the tablets containing the commandments{I'm sorry, perhaps they were requests} forgets one of these commandments immediately after descending from the mount back to his people then what the hell was the point?
Pure?Hell,try inhuman,psychotic mass murderers.How the hell do you manage to believe this crap to be some wonderous fable about man's relationship with god instead of a poorly verified record of an extraordinarily screwed up people? Faith? No,try ignorance.

And since you know you cannot see yourself,
so well as by reflection, I, your glass,
will modestly discover to yourself,
that of yourself which you yet know not of

This message is a reply to:
 Message 277 by Faith, posted 04-24-2005 2:40 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 293 by Faith, posted 04-24-2005 12:55 PM sidelined has not replied
 Message 294 by Faith, posted 04-24-2005 1:00 PM sidelined has not replied

Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2023 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.2
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2024