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Author Topic:   Safety and Effectiveness of Herbs and Pharmaceuticals
nwr
Member
Posts: 6409
From: Geneva, Illinois
Joined: 08-08-2005
Member Rating: 5.3


Message 92 of 209 (554637)
04-09-2010 11:55 AM
Reply to: Message 90 by Hyroglyphx
04-09-2010 11:23 AM


[mbrid=8332] writes:
There is also some concern that things like autism (which is dramatically increasing) is due to government mandated vaccinations. The claim is that "thimerosal," an additive in vaccines made from the compound, mercury, is the main cause. A court ruling recently determined that no significant link can be made. The debate is back and forth, I honestly can't say whether there is a link or not. One thing is for certain, it seems to me. Something in the environment or something we are ingesting is the cause, because there is no reason why there should be an increase as dramatic as it is unless it is something we are regularly in contact with.
I suspect that your analysis might be wrong.
My grandson was diagnosed with an autism spectrum disorder. After a more recent re-examination, it was concluded that he is actually normal, and that the diagnosis was mistaken.
I suspect that the reason autism is increasing, is because people are looking harder. I am not saying that they are all being misdiagnosed. Indeed, the diagnoses might be correct. But we are often diagnosing a child as autistic, when 20 years ago that child would have been treated as a bit odd, perhaps socially awkward - but nobody would have applied an "autism" label. That is to say, we are finding cases of autism because we are looking harder.
Perhaps there is an actual increase in the rate of autism, but because so much of what is seen can be explained as "we are looking harder," we need to be cautious in how we assess the evidence.
[mbrid=8332] writes in Message 87:
I refuse to take drugs in most instances, unless I am very sick (which is very rare).
Yes, I'm like that, too. I tend to think that nature's way is often the best. However, taking herbal remedies that are not part of our natural diet does strike me as unnatural, and just as unnatural as taking something made in a laboratory.
Full disclosure requires that I acknowledge that I am taking medication for hypertension. Nature does have its way of taking care of that - it is called death.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 90 by Hyroglyphx, posted 04-09-2010 11:23 AM Hyroglyphx has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 97 by Hyroglyphx, posted 04-09-2010 12:45 PM nwr has seen this message but not replied

  
nwr
Member
Posts: 6409
From: Geneva, Illinois
Joined: 08-08-2005
Member Rating: 5.3


Message 102 of 209 (554659)
04-09-2010 1:09 PM
Reply to: Message 100 by Apothecus
04-09-2010 1:06 PM


Re: Thimerosal does not cause autism
Apothecus writes:
Once again, the FDA has kowtowed to the anti-science fervor of the wing-nut crowd ...
I think its a mistake to put it that way.
A vaccine is useless if people are not actually vaccinated. IMO the FDA acted to increase the credibility of vaccines, so that more people might use them. It was not a matter of kowtowing.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 100 by Apothecus, posted 04-09-2010 1:06 PM Apothecus has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 104 by Apothecus, posted 04-09-2010 1:45 PM nwr has replied

  
nwr
Member
Posts: 6409
From: Geneva, Illinois
Joined: 08-08-2005
Member Rating: 5.3


Message 105 of 209 (554672)
04-09-2010 2:04 PM
Reply to: Message 104 by Apothecus
04-09-2010 1:45 PM


Re: Thimerosal does not cause autism
Apothecus writes:
Those screaming the loudest are the nutters who accuse the gov't of a vast vaccine conspiracy in which children are test subjects for some deeper purpose.
Yes, I agree with that. And nothing is going to persuade the nutters that vaccines are safe, not even the removal of thimerosal.
The main concern is with people who are sitting on the fence, who have heard of the controversy and are not sure how to respond to that. I see the FDA action as an attempt to reassure those people of the safety of vaccines by removing one on the causes of their uncertainty.

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nwr
Member
Posts: 6409
From: Geneva, Illinois
Joined: 08-08-2005
Member Rating: 5.3


Message 197 of 209 (556534)
04-20-2010 9:38 AM
Reply to: Message 194 by Kitsune
04-20-2010 9:16 AM


Kitsune writes:
My main concern is that we don't actually know a lot about what vaccines and the ingredients in them do to the body.
On the contrary, we know a lot.
Kitsune writes:
Common sense tells me, for example, that injecting poisons such as mercury or aluminium (in any amount) into the body is not a desirable thing.
In most cases, the body can deal with this in the small amounts present. You should be more concerned about what is in processed foods.
Kitsune writes:
The incidences of autism, autoimmune diseases, and ADHD have soared, ...
I don't think we actually know that. All we know is that the number of diagnoses have soared. It might be that the increase is because we are looking harder.
Kitsune writes:
More than 30 more vaccines -- would that be OK with you?
That sounds unnecessarily alarmist. A vaccine for malaria would be great. But I wouldn't expect that to be part of routine childhood vaccination except in regions where malaria is endemic.
Kitsune writes:
Vaccines for obesity, smoking, diabetes and addictions too?
Is that what the ranting, raving loonies are saying now?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 194 by Kitsune, posted 04-20-2010 9:16 AM Kitsune has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 198 by Kitsune, posted 04-20-2010 9:52 AM nwr has replied
 Message 199 by purpledawn, posted 04-20-2010 10:06 AM nwr has replied

  
nwr
Member
Posts: 6409
From: Geneva, Illinois
Joined: 08-08-2005
Member Rating: 5.3


Message 200 of 209 (556558)
04-20-2010 11:30 AM
Reply to: Message 199 by purpledawn
04-20-2010 10:06 AM


Re: Smoking Vaccine
purpledawn writes:
nwr writes:
Is that what the ranting, raving loonies are saying now?
They've been working on them.
Smoking vaccine study underway in Knoxville (8 Apr 2010)
If the smoking vaccine turns out to be effective, this will likely be an expensive vaccine that people voluntarily use to help them quit smoking. It isn't going to become part of routine childhood vaccinations.
The people making a fuss over this are raving ranting loonies.

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 Message 199 by purpledawn, posted 04-20-2010 10:06 AM purpledawn has seen this message but not replied

  
nwr
Member
Posts: 6409
From: Geneva, Illinois
Joined: 08-08-2005
Member Rating: 5.3


Message 201 of 209 (556570)
04-20-2010 11:53 AM
Reply to: Message 198 by Kitsune
04-20-2010 9:52 AM


Kitsune writes:
nwr writes:
On the contrary, we know a lot.
About what happens when you inject mercury and aluminium into the body?
My comment about knowing a lot was intended to apply to the question of what vaccines do. I made a separate comment on the preservatives and other components, but you neglected to quote that.
Kitsune writes:
People like to claim that about autism, though there's no proof that it's all a scare because doctors have got better at diagnosing. Also, it's pretty common knowledge (I thought) that ADHD and allergies are on the rise.
If allergies are on the rise, that probably has to do with things in the environment, rather than with vaccines.
When I was young, ADHD was never diagnosed. So sure, the rate is now higher, because people are looking for it.
There are many premature babies who survive today, but who would not have survived at times past. Some of these have development problems related to the premature birth. And that could one of the things that affects autism. And then there are more women giving birth at an older age, which is a known risk for some of these problems.
Kitsune writes:
You didn't answer the question by the way. What is your vaccination limit?
In my experience, the medical profession is very conservative in its decisions on making a vaccine part of the routine childhood vaccination schedule. I have no concerns about that.
For other vaccines, available if we choose, I don't see a problem in having such vaccines available for those who want them. My personal choice depends on the various risks and amount of protection involved. I do have annual flu shots. I have avoided any allergy treatments, whether vaccine or drug, on the basis that I can manage to put up with a little allergy from time to time.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 198 by Kitsune, posted 04-20-2010 9:52 AM Kitsune has not replied

  
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