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Author Topic:   if scientists accept God in science, is science destroyed?
Modulous
Member
Posts: 7801
From: Manchester, UK
Joined: 05-01-2005


Message 10 of 72 (444518)
12-29-2007 6:54 PM
Reply to: Message 9 by tesla
12-29-2007 5:40 PM


Re: so if God was accepted?
so if by the evidence in scientific law, that an intelligent entity is logically accepted as the basis of all things; (for the argument lets say it is so), would this acceptance hinder scientific enquiry?
If the evidence indicated that an intelligent entity - that could not hinder scientific inquiry. If there was no evidence of an intelligent entity and a scientist believed that it existed, then it could only hinder scientific inquiry if they believed that this entity influenced whatever it was they are studying.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by tesla, posted 12-29-2007 5:40 PM tesla has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 11 by tesla, posted 12-29-2007 7:13 PM Modulous has replied

Modulous
Member
Posts: 7801
From: Manchester, UK
Joined: 05-01-2005


Message 13 of 72 (444536)
12-29-2007 8:00 PM
Reply to: Message 11 by tesla
12-29-2007 7:13 PM


Re: so if God was accepted?
acceptance of an intelligent being would influence how?
It depends on how this being influences stuff. If it periodically stabs wicked people in the chest - then it might affect forensic science inquiry if the consensus of forensic scientists is convinced it exists. This is a psychological effect rather than a logical one.
would it negate evolution? (by the above assertions, no.)
It depends whether or not said intelligence is involved in the diversity of life as to how much the science of evolution would be affected.
would it negate the big bang?
That depends on what influence the entity has over the geometry of space/time.
If said entity has no influence upon the thing being studied - then it cannot affect the study of that thing. If it does affect the thing being studied then it has the possibility of affecting study.
my point of argument is to show that if science admits to an intelligent being being first, that science is only proof of the "how" of God, and no explanation of "why" of God.
Indeed - many scientists hold this position. For example, to differentiate from creationists, some people call themselves theistic evolutionists. A lot of the time, they simply say evolution was how God did it. Occasionally, the idea that god 'tweaks' things along from time to time creeps in. Normally it doesn't affect the science that is produced by these people, but I do think it devalues the god they believe in: after all either god pings it all into existence and doesn't need to make any changes other than to account for the actions of beings with free will OR god creates a wonderful algorithm that beautifully creates that which it willed in the first place. Any god that has to tinker with its creation to get it going in the direction it wants seems inferior to me.

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 Message 11 by tesla, posted 12-29-2007 7:13 PM tesla has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 14 by tesla, posted 12-29-2007 8:13 PM Modulous has replied
 Message 15 by Minnemooseus, posted 12-29-2007 8:14 PM Modulous has replied

Modulous
Member
Posts: 7801
From: Manchester, UK
Joined: 05-01-2005


Message 33 of 72 (444659)
12-30-2007 8:08 AM
Reply to: Message 14 by tesla
12-29-2007 8:13 PM


Re: so if God was accepted?
the God you just proposed would be outside of the principles of proven science, and therefore, false.
I was covering all bases. If you want to ask 'if an entity is proposed that doesn't get in the way of science - will it get in the way of science?" - then you are answering your own question.
within the observance of the initial assertions, would God effect science?
I have already answered this.
quote:
If the evidence indicated that an intelligent entity [exists] - that could not hinder scientific inquiry.

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 Message 14 by tesla, posted 12-29-2007 8:13 PM tesla has not replied

Modulous
Member
Posts: 7801
From: Manchester, UK
Joined: 05-01-2005


Message 34 of 72 (444660)
12-30-2007 8:09 AM
Reply to: Message 15 by Minnemooseus
12-29-2007 8:14 PM


Re: The tweaker God
I personally have no problem with a God that might sometimes adjust the parameters of his/her/its experiment. God thinks - "Well, this evolution experiment is interesting, but I wonder what would happen if I here influence the pathway a bit?"
I have no problem with such a deity - but it still seems inferior to me over a God who says 'I want outcome X.' and outcome X happens (either through pinging or through a devilishly clever algorithm.

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 Message 15 by Minnemooseus, posted 12-29-2007 8:14 PM Minnemooseus has not replied

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