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Author Topic:   Creationists: Why is Evolution Bad Science?
pink sasquatch
Member (Idle past 6044 days)
Posts: 1567
Joined: 06-10-2004


Message 115 of 283 (155248)
11-02-2004 3:27 PM
Reply to: Message 111 by NosyNed
11-02-2004 2:41 PM


Re: Prion surprise
The DNA is involved, I presume, in the creation of the normal protein. There isn't , I don't think, any difference in the DNA coding.
Sometimes the source of defective prion is in the DNA template. For example, there do exist human families with inherited, familial prion diseases that have been well linked to DNA mutations. There also seem to be cases where mutations arise later in life (akin to cancer) to produces infectious prion as well.
However, an organism doesn't need to have those DNA-level changes to develop a prion-based disease, they just need infectious prion protein from another organism introduced into their body (under certain conditions).
Infectious prion disease is of immediate health concern to humans, so it is usually thought of as an infectious disease. However, DNA-level changes in food animals may contribute to the problem, and so are worthy of study/discussion.
What I find fascinating is that the biological role of normal prion remains unknown...

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 Message 111 by NosyNed, posted 11-02-2004 2:41 PM NosyNed has not replied

Replies to this message:
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pink sasquatch
Member (Idle past 6044 days)
Posts: 1567
Joined: 06-10-2004


Message 143 of 283 (157474)
11-08-2004 10:31 PM
Reply to: Message 130 by winston123180
11-08-2004 10:02 PM


Welcome Winston!
The deep-sea Angler had to have been created with all its special equippment fully functional.
This is not true, though it is the basis for many arguments against evolution. Many call this "irreducible complexity". There are easy ways to envision evolution of attributes that the passage states are impossible. For example:
Ah, but there is a problem -- her next meal annot see the bait, since it is too dark under more than a mile of seawater. Starvation sets in while she waits for her first deep-sea fish dinner... The only possibility is that God created the Angler fish with all the fully-functional equipment it needed to survive at great depths. To solve the darkness problem, God created a special kind of light on the bait.
OR, the Angler fish didn't always live in lightless conditions. Perhaps the lure evolved first while the species lived in a more lighted environment. Subsequent mutations that made the lure more striking were selected for due to increased hunting success. Eventually a mutation occurred producing a glowing lure - once this occurred, the angler fish was free to colonize an environment previous inaccessible, and perhaps devoid of predators - the absolute darkness of the deep sea.
This is speculation, but is not unlikely let alone impossible. The passage you cite makes the assumption that the fish lived in darkness before adapting, rather than the more likely case that the fish developed an adaptation that allowed it to move into dark hunting grounds, potentially with fewer predators or competition - a great selective advantage.
if the first Anglers were surface fish and lost their air bladders, (through let's say, some unexplainable genetic mutation) and then sank to the bottom of the sea, they would have been crushed.
Evolution is usually not an all-or-nothing situation, though the author you cite would have you believe so. It is quite possible that the size of the swim bladder decreased slowly over hundreds or thousands of generations. At the same time, adaptation to the pressure could have developed gradually.
FYI, there is also very blatant errors in the passage, causing me to doubt the author's knowledge or intent:
Research scientists have broken down Luciferase into more than 1,000 proteins, but they still do not know how the heatless light is produced. Someone someday may figure out how God made this heatless light.
Luciferase consists of only two protein subunits, not 1,000 (there is no such thing as an enzyme consisting of 1,000 proteins). Also, the production of light by luciferase has been very well characterized by scientists, and is no mystery. A reference, though technical.
Finally as a stylistic note, it is good form to lay out your ideas in your own words and support them with quotes or references, rather than just quote someone else's words.
Please let me know if you have any questions...

This message is a reply to:
 Message 130 by winston123180, posted 11-08-2004 10:02 PM winston123180 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 144 by winston123180, posted 11-08-2004 10:45 PM pink sasquatch has replied

  
pink sasquatch
Member (Idle past 6044 days)
Posts: 1567
Joined: 06-10-2004


Message 146 of 283 (157482)
11-08-2004 11:03 PM
Reply to: Message 144 by winston123180
11-08-2004 10:45 PM


Winston,
No problem. Definitely feel free to participate and ask questions along the way - I'd enjoy answering them for you when I can. The participants here generally won't be harsh unless you start making unreasonable statements without evidence or foundation.
So far you've shown yourself to be quite reasonable.
Welcome and I'll keep an eye on your new thread.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 144 by winston123180, posted 11-08-2004 10:45 PM winston123180 has not replied

  
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