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Author Topic:   Verifying truth in science - is evolution faith-based?
robinrohan
Inactive Member


Message 21 of 104 (289224)
02-21-2006 3:05 PM
Reply to: Message 15 by Percy
02-20-2006 10:49 AM


But if by proven you mean broadly supported by evidence and widely accepted among the relevant community of scientists, then macroevolution is proven, just like many other theories, and your conclusion is incorrect.
A lot of the evidence seems circumstantial to me--except for the fossils.

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 Message 15 by Percy, posted 02-20-2006 10:49 AM Percy has not replied

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 Message 34 by nator, posted 02-21-2006 4:13 PM robinrohan has replied

  
robinrohan
Inactive Member


Message 36 of 104 (289262)
02-21-2006 4:20 PM
Reply to: Message 34 by nator
02-21-2006 4:13 PM


and the genetics.
I just meant that the evidence seems to be of a kind in which we say, if evolution is true, such-and-such has to be the case. Such-and-such is in fact the case. But this "such-and-such" is not precise enough to be called "predictive" exactly.
It's not like proving the theory of relativity by calculating where a heavenly body should be at a given point in time according to relativity calculations, and then that heavenly body shows up right at the predicted time--which I heard was done. It's not that type of evidence.
This message has been edited by robinrohan, 02-21-2006 03:20 PM
This message has been edited by robinrohan, 02-21-2006 03:22 PM

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 Message 34 by nator, posted 02-21-2006 4:13 PM nator has replied

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 Message 38 by Garrett, posted 02-21-2006 4:21 PM robinrohan has not replied
 Message 44 by nator, posted 02-21-2006 4:31 PM robinrohan has not replied
 Message 58 by crashfrog, posted 02-21-2006 6:29 PM robinrohan has replied

  
robinrohan
Inactive Member


Message 60 of 104 (289355)
02-21-2006 7:50 PM
Reply to: Message 58 by crashfrog
02-21-2006 6:29 PM


So, biology has bigger error bars. Does that make it illegitimate?
By no means illegitimate. I was just pointing out what type of evidence we had for evolution.

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 Message 74 by robinrohan, posted 02-24-2006 11:22 AM robinrohan has not replied

  
robinrohan
Inactive Member


Message 74 of 104 (290060)
02-24-2006 11:22 AM
Reply to: Message 60 by robinrohan
02-21-2006 7:50 PM


I suppose by "genetic evidence" for evolution is meant the DNA samples of different living species. So we find out that humans are 97% similar in their genotype to chimpanzees. And then I supposed they've gone on from there and shown man is related to other primates also, but not quite as closely. Then you could move from primates to whatever the next higher level is, and in all these cases you will find the genetic similarities gradually diminishing the further up you get taxonomically. I guess that's the way it works.
But what does this tell us? I think the idea is, if evolution is true, then the above scenario must be the case. The above scenario is in fact the case. It does not follow from this that evolution is necessarily true. What this DNA evidence does is eliminate a possible falsification.

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 Message 60 by robinrohan, posted 02-21-2006 7:50 PM robinrohan has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 75 by Modulous, posted 02-24-2006 11:58 AM robinrohan has replied

  
robinrohan
Inactive Member


Message 77 of 104 (290077)
02-24-2006 12:08 PM
Reply to: Message 75 by Modulous
02-24-2006 11:58 AM


Re: Faith and reasonable doubt
As best as is possible we can verify the conclusion of evolution, so under the definition set out in the OP, it does not require faith, whereas omnipotent beings do require faith.
This sounds like your saying that it's not so much that the evidence for evolution is definitive, but rather that the alternative, special creation, is clearly incredible.
This message has been edited by robinrohan, 02-24-2006 11:08 AM

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 Message 75 by Modulous, posted 02-24-2006 11:58 AM Modulous has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 78 by Modulous, posted 02-24-2006 12:12 PM robinrohan has replied

  
robinrohan
Inactive Member


Message 79 of 104 (290085)
02-24-2006 12:19 PM
Reply to: Message 78 by Modulous
02-24-2006 12:12 PM


Re: Faith and reasonable doubt
However, we can demonstrate many lines of evidence that infer evolution that agree with one another. Turning back to murder, if we had
1. DNA evidence,
2. fingerprint evidence,
3. a CCTV camera
4. a witness
5. a confession
6. no alibi
7. a bloody (victim's blood) weapon found at the suspect's house
8. a diary that details what the suspect was going to do, which matches up with what happened.
9. footprints that match the shoe size and type of the suspect
10. tyre tracks that match the suspect's vehicle,
11. which was caught on a speeding camera 200 metres from the location of the crime
12. The forensics pinpoint the time to within 20 minutes of the speed trap
13. etc
The question is whether the evidence for evolution is comparable to the above.

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 Message 78 by Modulous, posted 02-24-2006 12:12 PM Modulous has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 80 by Modulous, posted 02-24-2006 12:26 PM robinrohan has replied

  
robinrohan
Inactive Member


Message 82 of 104 (290092)
02-24-2006 12:30 PM
Reply to: Message 80 by Modulous
02-24-2006 12:26 PM


Re: Faith and reasonable doubt
I guess I don't understand this topic.

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