How about teaching evolution at Sunday school?

Cheer up, you evolutionists. One 'Jurassic Park' does far more for your cause than any number of Sunday school lessons do for the creationist's cause. Most kids have Dinosaur toys and can even name a lot of them, such as velociraptors. How many play with Arks these days?
The idea of million-year time frames, comet catastrophes (as opposed to a flood), and evolution in general creep in along with the excitement.
Viva, Hollywood!![This message has been edited by Mike Holland, 02-03-2003]

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Church is an institution of faith. People go there to worship and learn about their religion. There is a distinct differenbe between this and public schools.

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I completely agree with this (who'd a thunk it, hunh?). I think our friend Peter was being ever-so-tongue-in-cheek with his OP.

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The problem is not that the public schools are refusing to teach about creationism, but they are specifically attacking it. I agree with the seperation between Church and State, however, public schools should change the presentation of their science curriculum.

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This, on the other hand, I have something of a problem with. I assume you have some reference that shows that creationism is being specifically targeted in public schools (as this could ALSO be considered a violation of Church-State separation)? Please note that one example does not a trend invoke - to make this more than a baseless assertion, you're going to have to show that "creation-bashing" is both pernicious and widespread before the accusation would stick.Secondly, although I agree that evolution is badly taught in a lot of schools, you may be confusing the reasons. I NEVER received any in evolution in high school, although it was a long time ago. And the only HS biology curriculum that I'm familiar with that includes a great deal of evo bio is the international baccalaureate program in biology. At best, it is very poorly represented in most high school texts that I'm familiar with (which is not an exhaustive list or all-inclusive). In what way should public schools "change their presentation"? Are you proposing something like Johnson's "theistic science"? Just curious - and a topic for a different thread (with a bow to the Great Adminmooseus, long may he wave).

Hee, hee. Never thought of it that way, but you're probably right. Who'd of thought anything good would have EVER come out of Hollywood? Couple that with most of the programming on the various Discovery Channels, a lot of which is put out by those evil atheists at the BBC, and what chance does some poor child have of ever learning the Truth?

Evolution'ism'. is not a theory, no.The Theory of Evolution is a theory, though.If you read the message I was replying to, you will notice that TB wants to have his Biblically-based "explanations" of natural phenomena taught as science in public school science classrooms.Of course, my point was that there can be "explanations" of all kinds, including the "explanation" that the Great Galactic Goat made everything the way we see it today.The difference between Biblically-based "explanations", the Galactic Goat "explanation", and those of science is that only the scientific ones are based upon observation of nature, are falsifiable, and the observations are repeatable.

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This, on the other hand, I have something of a problem with. I assume you have some reference that shows that creationism is being specifically targeted in public schools (as this could ALSO be considered a violation of Church-State separation)? Please note that one example does not a trend invoke - to make this more than a baseless assertion, you're going to have to show that "creation-bashing" is both pernicious and widespread before the accusation would stick.

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I formed my opinion after attending public schools. Try to discuss creationism with a publich school teacher. Immediately their face will well up with fear and they adopt the "deer in the headlights" look. I never once could get a teacher to talk about it (which I found odd since I was always trying to debunk it).

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Secondly, although I agree that evolution is badly taught in a lot of schools, you may be confusing the reasons. I NEVER received any in evolution in high school, although it was a long time ago. And the only HS biology curriculum that I'm familiar with that includes a great deal of evo bio is the international baccalaureate program in biology. At best, it is very poorly represented in most high school texts that I'm familiar with (which is not an exhaustive list or all-inclusive). In what way should public schools "change their presentation"? Are you proposing something like Johnson's "theistic science"? Just curious - and a topic for a different thread (with a bow to the Great Adminmooseus, long may he wave).

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Generally everthing in public school is poorly taught. I do agree with your statement about evo biology, however, I can remember being in third grade and taking a field trip to a museum. My class was informed we were descendents of apes complete with the little ape to man poster on the wall. I really have not made any conclusions as to where my origins lie (evo or creation). I try to keep an open mind, however, i'll be damned if some scientist is going to tell me i'm nothing more than a very smart poo-flinging monkey.

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Evolution'ism'. is not a theory, no.

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Dictionary.com disagrees.Evolutionist Definition & Meaning | Dictionary.com

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If you read the message I was replying to, you will notice that TB wants to have his Biblically-based "explanations" of natural phenomena taught as science in public school science classrooms.

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I did read the message. My point was evolution is still a theory while it does have better supporting data than TB's theory. It is still a theory.

When Creationism has as much evidence supporting it as evolution, then it should be taught. However, seeing as the foundation for the idea of creationism is based in the bible, a document written about 300 BC by ancient authors who did not even know about fossils, or even microorganisms. Therefore, how can creationism get a forum in today's public schools? we do not learn the possibility that the greek gods exist. Those are supported by a far greater supply of ancient documents than creationism. This is because it is not supported by any evidence.

GOING OFF-TOPIC ALERT!Adminnemooseus------------------
{mnmoose@lakenet.com}

"Church is an institution of faith. People go there to worship and learn about their religion."True. But children go there because their parents make them or because they get treats in sunday school. It's evil to shove religion down children's throats and indoctrinate them before they're old enough to make clear decisions for themselves, and conveniently forget to tell them about any alternative belief systems/ scientific theories. All you do is narrow their minds until they realise they've been duped and rebell.[This message has been edited by Gzus, 02-04-2003]

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True. But children go there because their parents make them or because they get treats in sunday school. It's evil to shove religion down children's throats and indoctrinate them before they're old enough to make clear decisions for themselves, and conveniently forget to tell them about any alternative belief systems/ scientific theories. All you do is narrow their minds until they realise they've been duped and rebell.

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We all make decisions. No person is forced to do anything but be born and die. If a child does not want to eat cauliflower the child will do everything in his/her power not to eat it. Simple concept. Most children don't view sunday school in bad favor. My opinion is children will come to their own conclusions in life regardless of previous education or religion.A person is narrow minded on their own accord. Church teaches religion, however, they are not preventing any one from outside reading or learning.I am also curious about your "treats" statement. What do you mean?

Children only go to public school because their parents and the gov't make them, or because they get stickers. It's evil to cram language down a childs throat, conviniently forgetting to let them know about other languages, and systems of communication. All you do is bore their minds till they realize it's all crap and quit.------------------
Saved by an incredible Grace.

I've made comments related to this topic, somewhere, quite a while back. These have been dificult to track down, but I'll keep trying.My opinion here (and also in part in the previously unfound topic) is:Of course, evolution should not be expected to be taught in a church or sunday school that finds it to be contrary to their theology.But, what I wonder is, should evolution and/or anti-creationism be touched upon in those churches who find it to be compatible with their theology (and find fundimentalist creationism to be contrary to their theology).Also see "A Christian (and creationist)'s condemnation of "Creation Science"" at:
http://EvC Forum: A Christian (and creationist)'s condemnation of "Creation Science"
(this may be the "couldn't find it topic )Moose

I think the main point is that sunday school is a private organization and therefore should be left up to it's founders. Seeing that public school is forced by law, only untainted ideas should be reported. the Theory of evolution is supported by objective data, not emotional religious ideasHowever, the theory of evolution represents a much more viable and widely accepted explanation of the phenomena. Whereas creationism is not. Also, if a child attends sunday school, or church, the organization should be charged with teaching the child its private views. Because creationism is a religious idea, public schools should not be subjected to it, separation of church and state.------------------
i heart candy[This message has been edited by Winston Smith Asriel, 02-04-2003]

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However, the theory of evolution represents a much more viable and widely accepted explanation of the phenomena. Whereas creationism is not. Also, if a child attends sunday school, or church, the organization should be charged with teaching the child its private views. Because creationism is a religious idea, public schools should not be subjected to it, separation of church and state.

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I somewhat agree with this, however, I don't think children should be taught they are evolved monkeys because it's the popular theory. I should at least be told I could have come from a monkey or some ominous being named God.

if you go to church why do you need the public school to tell you?