Dual Porosity, A Problem For Dating? (for Whatever, etc...)

whatever, heating the rock matrix high enough to melt breaks down the crystaline structures which form the rock. Any argon which has been physically trapped in the crystaline structures will be released and boil off. There are no physical forces which would push or pull argon atoms into the crystals when the molten rock begins to cool and new crystal start to form.Your whole scenario is a complete fantasy and your explanations are only word salads. Who do you think you are fooling?

wj, If metamorphic rock is heated but has an layer of rock above, or sediments, the argon there is no atmospheric pressure for it to be released from the rock matrix as it recools, why wouldn't the argon just diffuse in and get retrapped within the crystal matrix, etc...P.S. I'm not a scientists, but JonF wanted me to explain how the sediments dating methods are meaningless, so I winged him up a theory, to explain how meaningless the dating methods are, however, I'm not a scientists, so won't beable to prove argon is actually being pressed into the crystal matrix, however, Argon is a carrier gas, it might well slip into the crystal matrix, given the forces of capillary pressures, in light that you say argon has all its electron shells filled, etc...[This message has been edited by whatever, 01-27-2004]

{grin}

That site is even kookier than Walt's.You really do believe any kook that comes down the pike with an isdea you like, don't you? You haven't even fallen off the turnip truck yet.Needless to say to anyone but you, the claims on that site are more balderdash unsupported by any evidence and directly contradicted by the observed evidence.The Earth has no overall electric charge, and there are no electric currents like the ones you claim are runing through it.

In other words, the only evidence you have that dating mehtods are wrong is that you want them to be wrong. That's been obvious for quite some time, but it's nice to see you admit it.Sorry, reality doesn't bend to your wishes. The Earth is old, the Universe is older, and life is almost as old as the Earth.

You close a thread and then open yourself up to the same nonsensical litany on dating. The real shame is that whatever did not use the interlude to actually start learning about some of the very science he is debating. Are you a masochist?CheersJoe Meert

I enjoyed the time off, perhaps too much, hope you're all cooled off a bit too, thought about this electric earth thing, never said there were macro electric currents, the problem seems more related to the micro electric currents, like the problems telegraph operaters in the early 1900's had, micro electric currents exists, its the reason a gas furnace alway are suppose to ground the gas lines to the copper water line, is it grounds the charges to earth ground, lightning rods too off this same principle, even power outages are believed caused by the sun causing electric surges in power lines, like the famous Canadian outage in Canada, which make one causes one to think in respect to the radioactive dating methods, given the earth is continually grounding ionic charges to ground, and K40 is converting to Ar40 due to electron gain in the nucleus, and magnetics is related to these micro electric currents, makes one wonder about the greater magnetic intensities of the magnetic reversals are expressing a greater micro electric currents existed in earths past, not sure if it was Andrew Snelling or Steve Autstin or both that said that the radioactive decay may not of been decaying at the same rate in the past, and just looking at the electric earth, accelerated decay seems more likely, explaining how our earth might actually be quite young, it is interesting that Benjamin Franklin proved lightning goes to earth ground, lots of interesting history, given the existence of these micro electric currents, and the belief its related to the magnetic expression of the earth, and that elements in the earth exibits some magnetic properties, this all makes dual porosity more plausible, argon and other elemental solutes coming into the micorpores, and due to these micro electric currents, causing ionic elemental movements in the crystal lattices of the rocks as solute electrolytes seek equilibrium, never reaching because the differences in solute concentrations in the micropores and macropores, as water runs into the water table, and trees draw from the water table, through the capillary water that bonds to the macropores, and leaches out of the micropores, the capillary press, dissolved argon pressing up into the micropores, being a slippery element because its electron shell is fully expressed, enhancing defussion (possibly explaining the free argon gas coming off coal mines and oil wells off gases, and diffusion, pressing into the crystal lattices because of the capillary pressures, I'm just agreeing to disagree, etc...I'm just trying to add imput, to cause you to think, why I brought up how the sediments could be quite young, frost causing rocks to press up out of the earth, in that these sediment testify they were deposited quite recently or all the rocks would of all pressed to the surface, frost typically only expressed by the upper 3.5 to 4 feet, the excess helium in the basement granite rocks also expressing these rocks were formed quite recently, how the other isotope dates in basement granites could be problematic due to the electric earth acceleration of isotope decay rates, affecting all the different decay rate's proportionally, dual porosity, ionic interplay in crystals lattices, then you have the problem with Snellings wood fossil that water had diffused through the basalt mineralizing his fossil a bit, this fossil expressed it was young due to the excess C-14, and the dating methods are based off an assumption that the radiocative decay has been constant, though the sediments would of dated old even before they erupted out from the earth, etc...P.S. Not planning on posting much, though its all been quite interesting, hopefully, I caused you all to but pause, and think outside the box, etc...[This message has been edited by whatever, 01-29-2004]
Adding only this little paragraph so if anyone carries on this topic its additional information.Dual Porosity in Liquefaction sediments are aided by anaerobic bacteria forming humic acids in anoxic zones that explains in part the mineralization before the lithification event of the sediments. Once lithification happens above the water table dual porosity becomes more of an aerobic remedial sedimentation process where kerogen itself is digestable by oxygen loving aerobic bacteria. Through dual porosity aided by aerobic bacteria minerals continue to be moved by the forces of dual porosity (the capillary solvent pump) etc...This message has been edited by The Golfer, 01-06-2006 11:46 AM

whatever I believe you may have to re-think this old boy.

---

'Everyone is entitled to his own opinion but not his own facts.'
(Daniel Patrick Moynihan)

That's not quite the proper terminology but it doesn't look wrong. It may be the only thing whatever's gotten right about dating.40K decays to 40Ar (10.5% of all decays) and 40Ca (89.5% of all decays). The decay to 40Ar is by one of three different routes, two (99.99% of decays to 40Ar) involving "electron capture" in which an orbital electron (usually from an inner shell) is captured by the nucleus, converting a proton to a neutron and emitting a neutrino. An electron moves from a higher orbit into the vacated orbit, emitting an X-ray.The remainder of the decays to 40Ar are by positron emission from the nucleus, again converting a proton to a neutron.

No, but maybe I'm not too smart ...

Jon FYes this is correct but the implication is that the process is related to 'micro electric' currents of which I find nothing on a search of the web.At least not in relation to currents within the earth.So ,though the point about the electron capture is spot on, it has no bearing on the context in which it is located.

---

'Everyone is entitled to his own opinion but not his own facts.'
(Daniel Patrick Moynihan)

I took "electron gain" as referring to electron capture ... I can't see how it could relate to anyting else, but, then, I can't relate much of anything "whatever" sats to reality, so I could well be wrong.Of course wherever there's water there's potential for electrical activity, and anodic protection of buried metal and the like is well known. But it doesn't affect decay of potassium, and electrons aren't even involved in the decay of any of the otehr elements used in radioisotope dating.