Register | Sign In


Understanding through Discussion


EvC Forum active members: 65 (9162 total)
2 online now:
Newest Member: popoi
Post Volume: Total: 915,815 Year: 3,072/9,624 Month: 917/1,588 Week: 100/223 Day: 11/17 Hour: 0/0


Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
Author Topic:   A little rant for desdamona
Trixie
Member (Idle past 3705 days)
Posts: 1011
From: Edinburgh
Joined: 01-03-2004


Message 16 of 85 (101912)
04-22-2004 5:47 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Sylas
04-22-2004 7:19 AM


I have to agree with Sylas
Des is really struggling to learn some of the concepts that we take for granted, but she's not going to learn much if things go on like this.
Firstly she's arguing against the ToE without knowing or understanding what the ToE actually states. Additionally she doesn't know what Darwin actually wrote in "Origin of Species". Now we can all argue until we're blue in the face about what Darwin was trying to say, or what he meant by using the words he did, but we can't argue over what he said exactly ie direct quotes.
Is it worth our while to pull together an essay which explains what the ToE actually states and also describes exactly what Darwin stated in O of S? I know that Des should have familiarised herself with this before attacking it all, but I've found that the more I've learnt in my career the more I've discovered what I don't know, yet at the beginning I thought I had a reasonable grasp! I believe that she has no idea of just how much she doesn't know and that's why she comes across as arrogant and rude.
I would suggest to Des that she drop the "Bible thumping" and stop hammering all of us over the head with her opinions and spend the time in finding out just exactly what evolutionists believe in the first place before condemning us all to Hell for believing something we don't!
Finally, to Des. If someone came into your house that you'd never met before and started behaving in the manner you've behaved on this forum, you'd be none too chuffed. Please Des, sit back, cool off and start getting to know the beliefs of atheist evolutionists, Christian evolutionists and Christian Creationists. I think you'll be pleasantly surprised!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Sylas, posted 04-22-2004 7:19 AM Sylas has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 18 by coffee_addict, posted 04-22-2004 6:31 PM Trixie has not replied
 Message 31 by nator, posted 04-22-2004 11:28 PM Trixie has not replied

  
Sylas
Member (Idle past 5260 days)
Posts: 766
From: Newcastle, Australia
Joined: 11-17-2002


Message 17 of 85 (101913)
04-22-2004 5:48 PM
Reply to: Message 14 by AdminAsgara
04-22-2004 4:26 PM


Re: A humble suggestion for the Queen
AdminAsgara writes:
Sylas's excellent post Style Guide for EvC should be one of the first pinned topics when that option becomes available to us.
Fighting down my shy retiring nature and painful modesty... may I propose that you simply place a link to the Style Guides thread as a footnote in the existing forum guidelines? Posts already remain archived indefinitely, don't they?
It is useful for a style guide to be a post itself; it serves as a fairly direct demonstration of some of concepts. Some people have already benefitted from just looking at the way I did things which were not actually discussed as guidelines. (You're welcome, Ned.)
Cheers -- Sylas

This message is a reply to:
 Message 14 by AdminAsgara, posted 04-22-2004 4:26 PM AdminAsgara has not replied

  
coffee_addict
Member (Idle past 477 days)
Posts: 3645
From: Indianapolis, IN
Joined: 03-29-2004


Message 18 of 85 (101926)
04-22-2004 6:31 PM
Reply to: Message 16 by Trixie
04-22-2004 5:47 PM


Re: I have to agree with Sylas
Trixie writes:
Des is really struggling to learn some of the concepts that we take for granted, but she's not going to learn much if things go on like this.
Sorry to be the bad guy of the thread, but I don't think this is the case at all. Yes, she is having a bit of trouble understanding the some of the concepts that we take for granted, but that is a problem that most people face at one time or other. But I think her real problem is her horrible reading comprehension skills. In fact, I don't think her reading comprehension could get her past middle school... if that.
It is this fact that scares me the most, because she claims to be a homeschool teacher. If her reading and writing skills are adequate to allow her to teach, I bet I can be a homeschool professor.
The only solution I can think of is for her to go back to school, shut the hell up, and listen to her teachers. An essay won't do jack s***, because she just can't comprehend correctly what she reads.
Check this forum out. I am a member on this forum. Most of the members there are 12-14 year olds. Even they can read and write better than she can.

The Laminator

This message is a reply to:
 Message 16 by Trixie, posted 04-22-2004 5:47 PM Trixie has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 19 by SRO2, posted 04-22-2004 6:52 PM coffee_addict has not replied
 Message 20 by Sylas, posted 04-22-2004 7:13 PM coffee_addict has not replied

  
SRO2 
Inactive Member


Message 19 of 85 (101929)
04-22-2004 6:52 PM
Reply to: Message 18 by coffee_addict
04-22-2004 6:31 PM


Re: I have to agree with Sylas
Nope, let me be worse. I've seen this all the time on other boards. It's called denial...if the truth doesn't fit your world view, then it isn't the truth. What we are writing right now will make absolutely no difference. Some people are like that. They can just put blinders on and ignore any thing else...they aren't posting to reason with, they are only here to preach their point of view...nothing else matters to them....I seen it a thousand times.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 18 by coffee_addict, posted 04-22-2004 6:31 PM coffee_addict has not replied

  
Sylas
Member (Idle past 5260 days)
Posts: 766
From: Newcastle, Australia
Joined: 11-17-2002


Message 20 of 85 (101942)
04-22-2004 7:13 PM
Reply to: Message 18 by coffee_addict
04-22-2004 6:31 PM


Sylas was home schooled
Since this is Free for All, topic diversions are fine with me. In fact, it would be a good thing to leave a bit of scope to engage more personally and reduce tensions.
Anyhow, the sub-title given is true. I was home schooled for my first three years of schooling. My mother acted as teacher for me and my brother. She is and remains a fine thoughtful Christian woman, and she gave my brother and I an excellent start for our education.
I was a voracious reader as a child, and ate up any educational opportunity given me. I can't be sure of all the many factors which have made me as I am; but I am sure one of them is the intense interest my parents took in me and fostering my childish enthusiasm to find out and explore.
The choice to home school was based more on circumstances than on principle. We used materials that were prepared for the Australian "School of the Air", which was intended for children learning at home in the far flung cattle stations of the outback. My parents were missionaries, and we were living in South Korea at the time. I sometimes think it would have been better for me to be at a Korean school, even if only to have the benefit of fluency in another language. But I understand something of why my parents chose as they did.
Taking on home schooling is an awesome responsibility; and very time consuming. It also has some major benefits, especially in the early years. We have another person in this forum who is very actively involved in what is a kind of semi-home school situation, from what I can see: truthlover. Truthlover is a very evangelical Christian, living in a Christian community, although has come to reconcile evolution with his faith. A most interesting man with a rather fascinating story. See, for example, Message 17 and the followon in the rest of the thread.
[This message has been edited by Sylas, 04-22-2004]

This message is a reply to:
 Message 18 by coffee_addict, posted 04-22-2004 6:31 PM coffee_addict has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 21 by SRO2, posted 04-22-2004 7:20 PM Sylas has not replied

  
SRO2 
Inactive Member


Message 21 of 85 (101945)
04-22-2004 7:20 PM
Reply to: Message 20 by Sylas
04-22-2004 7:13 PM


Re: Sylas was home schooled
The problem is, some Moms that home school...like my sister, can't differentiate between science class and bible study...you're Mom clearly could.
I don't think it's a good idea to prepare an 8 year old for seminary. My nephew, instead of watching toons in the morning, watches video tapes of worship services.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 20 by Sylas, posted 04-22-2004 7:13 PM Sylas has not replied

  
Sylas
Member (Idle past 5260 days)
Posts: 766
From: Newcastle, Australia
Joined: 11-17-2002


Message 22 of 85 (101968)
04-22-2004 8:07 PM


Sharing DNA
desdamona writes:
O.K. Lam, I mean the basic way people share DNA, via a lot of open mouth kissing, intercourse with several people, especially but not limited to, in a short amount of time, chronic uncleanliness and sharing your body with others while showering and bathing are neglected, not brushing teeth and kissing as many people as you can.
(This was quoted from Message 133, where it was off-topic. Quoted text reformatted to add white space after punctuation.)
The above is bizarre. None of the above cause sharing of DNA. They can share various germs, or viruses, but your own DNA is unaffected.
Germs, bacteria and viruses have their own DNA, of course, which is another matter. Your own human DNA is unaffected. The way a virus works has some association with DNA, since viruses tend to co-opt DNA duplication mechanisms in healthy cells to replicate themselves; but in the process they kill the cell. The real damage to health is from the destruction of the cell.
I am going to share with you what I learn about DNA, I know some about it, and still learning more and I'd love to share it with you. Hold onto your pants for a minute or an hour whichever it takes. You should know already how people get sick anyway.
This belongs in a new topic; but be warned. You don't actually know about DNA at all. Your comments are completely mistaken, and betray a total failure to comprehend what DNA is and how it might be involved with disease. People don't get sick by sharing DNA. In fact, this is just too stupid to be a new topic; so I am placing this here in the free for all thread, where topic diversions are less of a problem.
In the very next message Message 134 describes AIDS as DNA sharing. It isn't; and by the way, multiple consecutive posts on the same topic are not appreciated. Desdamona describes marriage as a safe way to share DNA. You don't share DNA with your partner. Rather, your children will have their own unique genome, half from each parent; but both parents retain their own DNA regardless of effects of marriage, poor hygiene, disease, or AIDS.
And finally (added in edit) from Message 141 Desdamona writes
Our DNA gets mixed with germs when we share it alot.
You can't share your DNA with anyone, except your children who get half of it by inheritance.
Cheers -- Sylas
[This message has been edited by Sylas, 04-22-2004]

  
Sylas
Member (Idle past 5260 days)
Posts: 766
From: Newcastle, Australia
Joined: 11-17-2002


Message 23 of 85 (102000)
04-22-2004 9:22 PM


Review... was I being fair?
This is a response to Message 143
desdamona writes:
Sylas, please don't think I'm trying to be rude, I'm really not. But you wrote such a lovely page on the rules and ideas here, I just wonder why you didn't act this way when discussing things with me, and knowing full well I was a newcomer, and with limited knowledge about these subjects, and things?
Where was the loving kindness that you profess?
This heartfelt and honest question merits a clear answer. I have not professed any particular level of loving kindness. I do try to engage with respect and courtesy and substance; but I am not sugar coated; and at times I can be a curmudgeon.
I do not believe that my discussions with you have failed to live up to standards of appropriate courtesy, even for a newcomer. I still don't think you quite appreciate that strong substantive disagreement with you is entirely consistent with courtesy.
However, this is a matter in which all of us can stand to reconsider. How are we treating others? I want to pull no punches in the substance of my material, but neither do I want to be unfair or gratuitously insulting, for newcomers most especially. So I've used the search facility to look over all the posts in which I mention your name, to review whether or not I have been fair. You can check also, if you like. The following links are the posts in question.
1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17
Message six was the first in which I mentioned the spelling and grammar problems; and you felt that was rude. I frankly disagree, and I tried to disclaim any intent to give a personal attack in that post, but I feel it very much needed to be said. Message ten also illustrated some corrections, after one of our forum administrators became fed up with the formatting errors, and tried to show you by example how it should appear. I took the chance to provide some of the other corrections also.
Generally, those two posts are the one which I feel went closest to the edge. No-one enjoys being corrected on such things in public. But on balance, I think it was worth saying.
You are writing here in an International forum. In one post you commented about "our nation" with the plain implication that I was in the USA. But in fact, I am in Australia. Your posts are quite literally being read all over the world. The errors were not just minor typos; but consistently dreadful. This has improved, by the way; and that is a good thing. It is well worth taking that extra bit of trouble. I usually have a dictionary beside me when writing.
The Style Guidelines are something I had been thinking of for some time. Your posts were the final impetus I needed to write it up. It is intended to be helpful to newcomers, and to help everyone get the most out of the forum, without causing offence.
Message 14 was my "little rant". No apologies. I think it was a much needed wake up call. I don't mind if you disagree; I will not make a habit of ranting. But at least you may appreciate how your posts have been coming across to others.
You have been on a very steep learning curve here, and I have sympathy for that. I believe I have consistently given you appropriate and substantive responses, which live up to a good level of courtesy, while also giving a robust engagement with the many trivial errors of fact.
The way to handle someone with limited knowledge, who in spite of that makes claims that are grossly incorrect, is not to sugar coat the response, but not to give gratuitous insults either. I think I have done that, and am satisfied with the manner in which I have conducted these exchanges.
If you are willing to continue engagement, I will be more than happy. I think perhaps you know a bit more about what to expect, and how to engage. This is a debate forum. Disagreement is the reason we exist. It you don't understand something, and make undefended claims about it anyway, you can expect your argument to be ripped to shreds and exposed for ignorance. This is not insult or unkindness. It is debate.
Best wishes -- Sylas

Replies to this message:
 Message 24 by SRO2, posted 04-22-2004 9:54 PM Sylas has not replied
 Message 25 by coffee_addict, posted 04-22-2004 9:59 PM Sylas has replied

  
SRO2 
Inactive Member


Message 24 of 85 (102009)
04-22-2004 9:54 PM
Reply to: Message 23 by Sylas
04-22-2004 9:22 PM


Re: Review... was I being fair?
Sylas,
I know I'm not the one you want to hear from, but you have been most courteous...I remember I gratuitously pointed out the accidental miss-placement of six elephants, and you graciously accepted my "ribbing" and even corrected it...you're a good man. I grow fond of you and extend my respect.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 23 by Sylas, posted 04-22-2004 9:22 PM Sylas has not replied

  
coffee_addict
Member (Idle past 477 days)
Posts: 3645
From: Indianapolis, IN
Joined: 03-29-2004


Message 25 of 85 (102010)
04-22-2004 9:59 PM
Reply to: Message 23 by Sylas
04-22-2004 9:22 PM


Re: Review... was I being fair?
Sylas, I have to admire your patience and willingness to devote your time to such... torture.
Unlike you, I am not patient at all. I can't stand ignorant people that think they have it all figured out. I can't stand ignorant people that have no will to learn.
Well, my excuse for being so impatient is I'm young. I'm sure I will grow out of it in time. But for now, ignorant people that think you've got it all figured out better stay away from me.

The Laminator

This message is a reply to:
 Message 23 by Sylas, posted 04-22-2004 9:22 PM Sylas has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 27 by Sylas, posted 04-22-2004 10:44 PM coffee_addict has not replied

  
Cold Foreign Object 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3047 days)
Posts: 3417
Joined: 11-21-2003


Message 26 of 85 (102026)
04-22-2004 10:37 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Sylas
04-22-2004 7:19 AM


Sylas quote:
______________________________________________________________________
Evolution is not faith. It is science, the same as physics, or chemistry, or any other field of science. It is not based on suppositions or a desire to reject God or a need to overturn the bible.
______________________________________________________________________
The branch of science called scientism sure exists to reject God and overturn Genesis. Doesn't matter what you claim - opinions/hatreds about the God of Genesis does not cease at the laboratory door. Weren't you the guy at my door trying to sell a bridge in Brooklyn ?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Sylas, posted 04-22-2004 7:19 AM Sylas has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 29 by jar, posted 04-22-2004 11:17 PM Cold Foreign Object has not replied
 Message 32 by Rand Al'Thor, posted 04-22-2004 11:51 PM Cold Foreign Object has not replied
 Message 33 by nator, posted 04-22-2004 11:59 PM Cold Foreign Object has not replied

  
Sylas
Member (Idle past 5260 days)
Posts: 766
From: Newcastle, Australia
Joined: 11-17-2002


Message 27 of 85 (102028)
04-22-2004 10:44 PM
Reply to: Message 25 by coffee_addict
04-22-2004 9:59 PM


Re: Review... was I being fair?
Lam writes:
... better stay away from me.
Hi folks,
This is the Laminator; our fascinating experiment in splicing Velociraptor genes into a human genome. Cute, isn't he. (Down boy. Bad laminator. It's not dinnertime yet; leave that cat alone.)
He's really quite lovable and harmless. Throw him a raw steak now and again, and he's good as gold. Usually. Quite often anyway.
Cheers -- Sylas
PS.
[This message has been edited by Sylas, 04-23-2004]

This message is a reply to:
 Message 25 by coffee_addict, posted 04-22-2004 9:59 PM coffee_addict has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 28 by AdminAsgara, posted 04-22-2004 10:51 PM Sylas has not replied

  
AdminAsgara
Administrator (Idle past 2302 days)
Posts: 2073
From: The Universe
Joined: 10-11-2003


Message 28 of 85 (102031)
04-22-2004 10:51 PM
Reply to: Message 27 by Sylas
04-22-2004 10:44 PM


Re: Review... was I being fair?
Geez Sylas...now you've done it. You know he gets testy when you introduce him that way.
Well, all I can say is I refuse to take any responsibility for the next missing newbie. That is now on your head.

AdminAsgara
Queen of the Universe

This message is a reply to:
 Message 27 by Sylas, posted 04-22-2004 10:44 PM Sylas has not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 29 of 85 (102040)
04-22-2004 11:17 PM
Reply to: Message 26 by Cold Foreign Object
04-22-2004 10:37 PM


quote:
The branch of science called scientism sure exists
WHAT????
scientism ????????
And just what branch of science is that? You know, I checked just about every school I know of and I couldn't find a single place where I could major in scientism.
Thank you. You made my evening. Monty Python could not have done better. Nudge, Nudge.

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
 Message 26 by Cold Foreign Object, posted 04-22-2004 10:37 PM Cold Foreign Object has not replied

  
nator
Member (Idle past 2169 days)
Posts: 12961
From: Ann Arbor
Joined: 12-09-2001


Message 30 of 85 (102044)
04-22-2004 11:24 PM
Reply to: Message 14 by AdminAsgara
04-22-2004 4:26 PM


Re: A humble suggestion for the Queen
quote:
3. Des needs to learn to write in a manner that does not leave her opponents shuddering when they think that she is home-school teacher.
Oh my.
A HOME SCHOOL TEACHER???!!!
Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 14 by AdminAsgara, posted 04-22-2004 4:26 PM AdminAsgara has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 39 by coffee_addict, posted 04-23-2004 1:36 AM nator has not replied

  
Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2023 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.2
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2024