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Author | Topic: Evolution or Creation | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ICANT Member Posts: 6769 From: SSC Joined: Member Rating: 1.6 |
Why should I choose Atheism and Evolution over God and Creation?
In Genesis 1:1 it says that In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. Most go right to Genesis 1:2 and start the creation but it was created in Genesis 1:1. Somehow I think the scriptures got mixed up as in: Gene 2:4 (KJS) These [are] the generations of the heavens and of the earth when they were created, in the day that the LORD God made the earth and the heavens,In the day the Lord God made the earth and heavens. This account corresponds to Genesis 1:1 Gene 5:1 (KJS) This [is] the book of the generations of Adam. In the day that God created man, in the likeness of God made he him; This says the book of generations of Adam in the day that God created man in the likeness of God. This account corresponds with the account in Genesis 1:2 - 2:3 Therefore I believe and propose that somewhere back in time as we know it that God created the heavens and the earth. I believe at that moment it was perfect in every way. The best I get is that there was no sea at this time. There was no day and night just day as God was the light. So when God told Adam the day he ate the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil he would die, he did die the same day. This day could have lasted millions of years in our time as there was no time then. This man was not as we know man today. He was formed from the dust of the earth and God breathed into his nostrils and he became a living soul.I do not think he was limited as we are as he could probably teleport himself where ever he wanted to go. To name all the animals he had to be a very smart man. I believe he was the smartest man that has ever walked on the face of the earth, other than the God man. At many points in time and the last probably about 66 million years ago there were extinction events. I assume all life forms was destroyed I have no way of knowing. Except when we get to Genesis 1:2 the earth was void and without form and now it had water.Then we have the 7 days of Moses, the recreation, Gen. 1:2 - Gen. 2:3. Gene 1:11 (KJS) And God said, Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, [and] the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed [is] in itself, upon the earth: and it was so. {grass: Heb. tender grass} Pay special attention to the seed in itself upon the earth. How did those seed get there if they were not there before? Gene 1:26 (KJS) And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth. 27 So God created man in his [own] image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them. Gene 1:28 (KJS) And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth. {moveth: Heb. creepeth} Man blessed and told to multiply and replenish the earth. He could not replenish it if it had not been inhabited before. I have never been able to buy into the idea that man just happened. I have always needed to know that my life was worth something and there was a reason for it. The only place I found that was in the Bible. Now I am a realist and I know man has copied the manuscripts and has probably arranged things to suit themselves along the way and even added and took away things. But I believe that God has preserved His Word. I have studied many Bibles and have been able to find the core teachings that I believe in 90 % of them. The Bible is the only book that I have read so far that tells me where I came from. Why I am here, and where I will spend eternity. Some things the Bible tells me: That God made me so I could choose to love and serve Him just because He is God.That man has a sin nature he inherited from Adam. God provided a sacrifice to pay my sin debt. Jesus the only begotten Son of God was crucified that I might be saved. That to go to heaven I must trust in That Sacrifice. That if I do nothing I will spend eternity in the lake of fire. That Christ was buried and arose 3 days later. That 40 days later he ascended into Heaven to make intercession for me. That Jesus is coming again. That I will be judged according to how I have done on earth and will be rewarded accordingly. That all who have not trusted Christ will stand at the Great White Throne judgment and confess Jesus is Lord. That all whose names are not written in the Lambs Book of Life will be cast into the Lake of Fire. That there will be a new Heaven and Earth. That there will be no more day or night as God will be the light. That there will be a City, The New Jerusalem that has streets of Gold,where I will live with God for eternity. I have had a happy full life and enjoyed every minute of it and I can say as Paul said, I have fought a good fight I have kept the faith and if it does end with my death what have I lost. I would not trade what I have had and still have for all the money Bill Gates and Warren Buffet have put together. That money could not buy the peace and satisfaction I have had for the past 58 years. I have never needed anything that my God has not supplied. Now these are the things I believe and have through my faith in God. Now I know that most of you cannot relate to what I believe. You think it is a myth, some even call it a lie, some would say I am deluded. But if when I die that is all there is to it what have I lost? Evolution as I understand it, teaches us that we evolved from a life form that we do not know where it came from, why, or how it got here yet.Chiroptera tells me we are not much different than a worm. quote:If we are no different than the animals, birds, fishes, or worms then when we die we return to where ever it was that we came from and that is the end of it. But what if I am right and there is a heaven to gain and a hell to avoid? I posted what I believe so that those wishing to respond would know where I am coming from. But I want to limit the discussion to the question's below. What benefit would it be for me to renounce God and creation and embrace Atheism and evolution?For that matter what benefit is derived by anyone choosing Atheism and Evolution over God and Creation?
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ICANT Member Posts: 6769 From: SSC Joined: Member Rating: 1.6 |
You people just don't get it do you?
I have believed in God every since I read the Bible for the first time at age 7. I am now 67 years old, I trusted Christ as my personal saviour at the age of 9 and received eternal life at that time and any time that ever comes to be present time. Now this is what my God did for me. He sent His only begotten Son to die in my place so I could spend eternity with Him in Heaven. And YES I CHOSE to accept the free gift offered by God.Just as each of you have chosen to believe what you do. But that has nothing to do with the question. I have just stated a very short version of what my God has done for me, and will do for anyone that will trust Him for eternal life. What I am asking is, what does Atheism have to offer? What does Evolution have to offer? I know you say it is just change over time. But you also have to say man evolved from that first single cell of life. That means he does not have a Spirit. You cannot believe in the total package of evolution and believe that God formed the first man from the dust of the earth and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life. (Genesis 2:7) Nor can you believe that He made the second man in His image. (Genesis 1:27) Granny used to say son you can't have your cake and eat it too. Either there is a God who created everything like He said. OR There is no God and we just happened. So I ask again , What would be the BENEFIT of my great grandson who has about 3 months to birth yet have in not believing in God and His creation and instead believing that there is no God and we just happened?
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ICANT Member Posts: 6769 From: SSC Joined: Member Rating: 1.6 |
that an atheist has to believe in evolution No one has to believe in anything. But they choose to believe in certain things. Edited by ICANT, : No reason given.
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ICANT Member Posts: 6769 From: SSC Joined: Member Rating: 1.6 |
Of course. You need to understand that the tales in Genesis were meant to teach a theological lesson, not a science lesson. But jar I believe they are an accurate account of what happened in the beginning, and then at a later date.
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ICANT Member Posts: 6769 From: SSC Joined: Member Rating: 1.6 |
Why would god set us that trap? What has this got to do with the question I asked? What is the benefit of believing in no God and that we just evolved?
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ICANT Member Posts: 6769 From: SSC Joined: Member Rating: 1.6 |
You are the one who has to decide whether you want to continue to believe what has been shown to be totally false. jar no one has shown me that what I believe Genesis teaches about the creation is false. As I have said no one believes what I believe Genesis teaches, or at least they won't admit it. No one listens to it just as everybody is ignoring the questions I set out in the beginning op.
quote: God tells me He created the Heavens and the Earth and everything in them.God promises me eternal life if I believe and trust Him. Atheism promises????????????????????????death.Evolution says I just evolved from a single cell life form that no one knows where it came from, how or why. In a universe that no one knows where it came from, how or why.
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ICANT Member Posts: 6769 From: SSC Joined: Member Rating: 1.6 |
i would think one would believe for more than just getting eternal life. but hey, that's me. I don't think at 9 years old I would have been thinking of personal gain. But it is a nice thing to have just because I believe Him. So what would I gain from being an atheist, and believe I evolved from from a single cell life form, that nobody knows where it came from, how or why?
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ICANT Member Posts: 6769 From: SSC Joined: Member Rating: 1.6 |
Are you seriously suggesting that such a calculation would be your basis for what you would subsequently believe? If you read the op you read that I would not trade what I have for all the money Bill Gates and Warren Buffet have put together. Those are two of the richest men in the world. That should tell you what kind of value I place on what I have at the present.
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ICANT Member Posts: 6769 From: SSC Joined: Member Rating: 1.6 |
It has been pointed out that you cannot choose to believe. Do you mean to tell me when I first read the Bible at the age of 7 I did not have a choice to believe it or not? If you cannot choose to believe how do you get belief?
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ICANT Member Posts: 6769 From: SSC Joined: Member Rating: 1.6 |
Why do you think you would lose it, as an atheist? No crashfrog I would not have it. "John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."
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ICANT Member Posts: 6769 From: SSC Joined: Member Rating: 1.6 |
Who cares about money? do you value it enough to chose willfull ignorance? quote: Lets see I have had a happy full life and enjoyed every minute of it.I have had peace and satisfaction for the past 58 years. (I am 67) I have never needed anything that my God has not supplied. I would rather have these things and be ignorant and unlearned and go into Heaven and spend eternity there. Than: To be the most knowledgeable person cast into the lake of fire to suffer forever.
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ICANT Member Posts: 6769 From: SSC Joined: Member Rating: 1.6 |
That wasn't the question though. The question was "Why?" What I have comes from God if I was an atheist I would never have had what I have.
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ICANT Member Posts: 6769 From: SSC Joined: Member Rating: 1.6 |
So what, exactly, do you lose in this life as an atheist? OK so what do I lose by believing in God?If I die and that is it what have I lost. I have been happy and fulfilled. If I am right and there is a God and a Heaven I will spend eternity with Him. If you are right and you have been happy and fulfilled you have not lost anything. But if you are wrong and there is a God and a place prepared for all those who do not trust in Him. You Lose big time. This is the reason I ask, what is the benefit for me or anyone to be an atheist?
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ICANT Member Posts: 6769 From: SSC Joined: Member Rating: 1.6 |
The possibility of something new entering your head must be frightening indeed for you. Archer you know nothing about me. Just to give you some idea of some things that go through my head. I believe God spoke the universe into being in the far distant past a lot further than 14 billion years ago, maybe even trillions of years ago, or longer. When science catches up and gets some better ways of dating things you may find out that I am right. So you eat, drink and be merry for one day you will die, then what? The judgment.
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ICANT Member Posts: 6769 From: SSC Joined: Member Rating: 1.6 |
So, you seem to be saying that your God punishes people who are curious and knowledgeable about nature and rewards people who are willfully ignorant about nature. No nator you said that. I said God will cast everyone who does not trust in Him into the lake of fire where they will suffer forever. I have nothing against education I did go to college.And I have stated that I am here still trying to learn.
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