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Author Topic:   The Meaning Of The Trinity
jar
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Posts: 34136
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 65 of 1864 (390008)
03-17-2007 1:22 PM
Reply to: Message 64 by Phat
03-17-2007 1:13 PM


Re: Not henotheism
My answer is that the real Spirit finds you...you do not find God.
So you are claiming that even though GOD creates all, She decides to not to even acknowledge some of Her creation.

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
 Message 64 by Phat, posted 03-17-2007 1:13 PM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 67 by Phat, posted 03-17-2007 9:37 PM jar has replied

  
jar
Member
Posts: 34136
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 68 of 1864 (390056)
03-18-2007 12:47 AM
Reply to: Message 67 by Phat
03-17-2007 9:37 PM


Re: Not henotheism
You said
My answer is that the real Spirit finds you...you do not find God.
Now you say:
No...its that people don't acknowledge her.....(and I still don't know why you say "she" since Jesus is male)
Jesus is not a male nor is the Holy Spirit.
So which is it Phat, your former statement or the latter?

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
 Message 67 by Phat, posted 03-17-2007 9:37 PM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 71 by Phat, posted 03-18-2007 11:47 AM jar has replied
 Message 212 by Phat, posted 08-15-2016 12:37 PM jar has replied
 Message 1274 by Phat, posted 02-15-2023 8:19 AM jar has not replied

  
jar
Member
Posts: 34136
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 72 of 1864 (390091)
03-18-2007 11:52 AM
Reply to: Message 71 by Phat
03-18-2007 11:47 AM


Re: Not henotheism
So you would go with:
My answer is that the real Spirit finds you...you do not find God.
Is that correct?
Have you thought that through?
Do you understand the implications of that?

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
 Message 71 by Phat, posted 03-18-2007 11:47 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 78 by Phat, posted 07-22-2013 8:36 AM jar has replied

  
jar
Member
Posts: 34136
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 79 of 1864 (703454)
07-22-2013 8:53 AM
Reply to: Message 78 by Phat
07-22-2013 8:36 AM


Re: Not henotheism
How can there be any justification for judging anyone on what they believe?
I agree that what we believe influences what we do, and I believe that is one of the worst things about Christianity as marketed in the US. The "Saved" and "Forgiven" and "Christ died to pay for my sins" marketing spiels are vile and evil.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 78 by Phat, posted 07-22-2013 8:36 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
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jar
Member
Posts: 34136
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 84 of 1864 (735457)
08-15-2014 4:55 PM
Reply to: Message 83 by Phat
08-15-2014 4:43 PM


Re: Re-Trinity
But what does the Bible say?

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 83 by Phat, posted 08-15-2014 4:43 PM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 364 by Phat, posted 02-28-2018 9:37 AM jar has replied

  
jar
Member
Posts: 34136
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 107 of 1864 (735658)
08-20-2014 8:10 PM
Reply to: Message 106 by NoNukes
08-20-2014 7:46 PM


Re: The Limitations Of Good And Evil Behaviors
Man created the concept of evil and a moral sense exists only within the mythos of a culture, society or era. It totally arbitrary and it too evolves over time.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

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jar
Member
Posts: 34136
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 145 of 1864 (735884)
08-27-2014 3:15 PM
Reply to: Message 143 by Phat
08-27-2014 2:25 PM


misrepresentation, moving goal posts and quotemining.
quote:
Phat writes:
The messenger and the message are one.
ringo writes:
That's just a meaningless sound-bite. ...The messenger, at best, is an example of the message.
OK, lets discuss this for a moment. Start with Matthew. Whats the purpose of Jesus,according to the message?
Matt 1:20-21 writes:
an angel of the Lord appeared to him in a dream and said, "Joseph son of David, do not be afraid to take Mary home as your wife, because what is conceived in her is from the Holy Spirit. 21 She will give birth to a son, and you are to give him the name Jesus, because he will save his people from their sins."
Note: It does not say He will be an example of how to live and will teach the people not to sin...He will actually be a savior.
Shall we continue?
Great example and sure, let's continue.
That passage follows one of the two mutually exclusive genealogies and is followed by the answer to your question.
The passage you (once again) took out of context is a great example of palming the pea instead of answering the question, creating a self-fulfilling prophecy, misrepresenting what is actually written and Biblical quotemining as pointed out in Matthew 1 itself.
Matt 1 writes:
20 But while he thought on these things, behold, the angel of the Lord appeared unto him in a dream, saying, Joseph, thou son of David, fear not to take unto thee Mary thy wife: for that which is conceived in her is of the Holy Ghost.
21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name Jesus: for he shall save his people from their sins.
22 Now all this was done, that it might be fulfilled which was spoken of the Lord by the prophet, saying,
23 Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.
24 Then Joseph being raised from sleep did as the angel of the Lord had bidden him, and took unto him his wife:
25 And knew her not till she had brought forth her firstborn son: and he called his name Jesus.
Note that the writer of that part of Mathew commits all of those things but you too pulled one pieces parts out of context.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 143 by Phat, posted 08-27-2014 2:25 PM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 146 by Phat, posted 08-27-2014 3:23 PM jar has replied

  
jar
Member
Posts: 34136
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 149 of 1864 (735903)
08-27-2014 5:20 PM
Reply to: Message 146 by Phat
08-27-2014 3:23 PM


Re: misrepresentation, moving goal posts and quotemining.
But you are not building an honest case when you exclude evidence that refutes your position. That is the basic dishonesty that forms the foundation of "Biblical Christianity".
Phat writes:
Ringo essentially says that we should be more concerned with believing(and doing) what Jesus taught rather than in Jesus Himself. I maintain that the two are essentially inseparable.
Jesus seems to agree with Ringo, not you.
Life requires real food, real shelter, real clothing, real health care, real protection not imagined platitudes.
Edited by jar, : add part deux

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

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 Message 146 by Phat, posted 08-27-2014 3:23 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
jar
Member
Posts: 34136
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 3.4


(1)
Message 166 of 1864 (736071)
09-01-2014 1:37 PM
Reply to: Message 165 by Jon
09-01-2014 12:09 PM


Re: The Limitations Of Good And Evil Behaviors
Also, at least according to the Bible, God is quite often unsure of what is right or wrong and just like us, God struggles over morality and changes his position.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

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 Message 165 by Jon, posted 09-01-2014 12:09 PM Jon has seen this message but not replied

  
jar
Member
Posts: 34136
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 3.4


(1)
Message 169 of 1864 (736098)
09-02-2014 12:19 PM
Reply to: Message 168 by ringo
09-02-2014 12:13 PM


Re: The Limitations Of Good And Evil Behaviors
ringo writes:
That would be the Watering The Soup Defense - the soup may be thinned to cover more territory but all of the ingredients are still there.
Or the "loaves and fishes defense" I imagine.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

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 Message 168 by ringo, posted 09-02-2014 12:13 PM ringo has seen this message but not replied

  
jar
Member
Posts: 34136
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 184 of 1864 (781930)
04-10-2016 8:25 AM
Reply to: Message 181 by Phat
04-10-2016 6:38 AM


Re: The Limitations Of Good And Evil Behaviors
the question was...
quote:
What, other than marketing, does prayer or fasting add?
... but you replied only by posting one of the definitions of a sacrament.
How does that answer the question?

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 181 by Phat, posted 04-10-2016 6:38 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 185 by Phat, posted 04-10-2016 9:21 AM jar has replied

  
jar
Member
Posts: 34136
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 186 of 1864 (781933)
04-10-2016 9:49 AM
Reply to: Message 185 by Phat
04-10-2016 9:21 AM


the "Man does not live by bread alone" con
Let's head back towards the Trinity maybe but first a comment about that last quote mine.
Phat writes:
Fasting also reminds us that man does not live by bread alone but by every word that proceeds from the mouth of God.
That is one of the greatest marketing scams used by Christianity. It is used solely as a marketing tool and serves no other purpose than provide an excuse for not doing what Jesus said we should do.
That quote is just the snake-oil salesman's pitch from the back step of the medicine wagon while the shills in the audience shout out the amens and hallelujahs. It's used only as a preface to a sales pitch and never before actually telling folk that it really is their problem, that they caused and that they are charged to solve.
Fasting should remind us of what it feels like to be hungry, to create a bond of empathy between our fat fed selves and those that do not get bread. It should show us that even every word that proceeds from the mouth of God is no substitute for bread.
Now maybe back to the Trinity; the Great Inscrutable.
Edited by jar, : fix sub-title
Edited by jar, : appalin spallin: then ------> than

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 185 by Phat, posted 04-10-2016 9:21 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 188 by NoNukes, posted 04-11-2016 1:21 AM jar has replied
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jar
Member
Posts: 34136
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 3.4


(2)
Message 189 of 1864 (781940)
04-11-2016 9:01 AM
Reply to: Message 188 by NoNukes
04-11-2016 1:21 AM


Re: the "Man does not live by bread alone" con
The issue is not fasting itself but rather how that verse is used so often in the Christian Cult of Ignorance. As Phat used it the implication is that words are as good as food. Too often I hear Christians use that verse when they are challenged for not giving aid.
Fasting itself can be very useful but it cannot replace bread. Give a hungry man a verse and he will still be hungry.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 188 by NoNukes, posted 04-11-2016 1:21 AM NoNukes has replied

Replies to this message:
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jar
Member
Posts: 34136
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 3.4


Message 213 of 1864 (789480)
08-15-2016 12:52 PM
Reply to: Message 212 by Phat
08-15-2016 12:37 PM


Re: Not henotheism
I believe that is what the Nicene Creed says.
And Jesus or the Holy Spirit if they exist today are not alive and so have no gender as we understand it.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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 Message 219 by Phat, posted 10-19-2016 11:20 AM jar has seen this message but not replied

  
jar
Member
Posts: 34136
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 3.4


(1)
Message 227 of 1864 (794416)
11-15-2016 11:31 AM
Reply to: Message 224 by Phat
11-14-2016 6:55 PM


who is limiting God?
Phat writes:
People who claim to limit God to a fig newton of our imagination have essentially missed the point---that God is more than they can swallow.
God is a much bigger concept than ringo feeding people and doing his chores.
First, no one other than God is limiting God.
What people are actually saying is that people need food, need clothes, need shelter, need protection, need healing, need comforting, need educating.
Chores need to get done.
If God wants to feed the people, clothe the naked, shelter the homeless, protect the weak, heal the sick, comfort the sorrowful, educate the ignorant and do the chores then great but looking around it does not seem that God wants to do all that.
Yet people still need food, need clothes, need shelter, need protection, need healing, need comforting, need educating and until God does it there is no other option but man doing it.
Chores still need to get done and until God does them there is no other option but man doing them.
Now if you have some bigger concept that has some value or worth then perhaps this is a great time to present it. Folk are open to learning what this bigger concept is and how it will feed the hungry, clothe the naked, shelter the homeless, protect the weak, heal the sick, comfort the sorrowful, educate the ignorant and do the chores.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
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