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Member (Idle past 4660 days) Posts: 3435 From: Edmonton Alberta Canada Joined: |
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Author | Topic: The Meaning Of The Trinity | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Phat Member Posts: 14881 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: |
Duly noted.
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain " *** “We must realize that the Reformation world view leads in the direction of government freedom. But the humanist world view with inevitable certainty leads in the direction of statism. This is so because humanists, having no god, must put something at the center, and it is inevitably society, government, or the state.”- Francis A. Schaeffer “The whole war between the atheist and the theist comes down to this: the atheist believes a 'what' created the universe; the theist believes a 'who' created the universe.”
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Base12 Junior Member (Idle past 77 days) Posts: 22 Joined: |
The Trinity is explained in this verse...
Romans 1:20 The Trinity or Godhead is what things are made of. That's what the verse says, and that what I believe. What are things made of that consist of three components? Atoms. Simple. Not sure why this is even a debate.
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Juvenissun Member (Idle past 60 days) Posts: 332 Joined: |
In order to believe in the nature of Trinity, you must first believe that there is a single God. Do you believe that? Let's make it easier, are you willing to accept the assumption that there is a God? This is serious. Once you accept the assumption, then you can not negate it in any of your later argument. Are you willing to accept the assumption that there is ONE God, and ONLY ONE God? Edited by Juvenissun, : No reason given.
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Phat Member Posts: 14881 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: |
The only thing that stumps me there is the claim that they used to believe and now don't. This seems to only be possible if one values objective evidence and rationality over their belief. I would maintain that there is not a lot of objective evidence either way...and that it is far from conclusive.
![]() You seem puzzled why this is a "debate". Might I ask you what else it could possibly be? The art of discussion and debate is an old and honorable one. May I ask you why you joined? Don't you want to be challenged? Also...it is my understanding that for the Trinity to be what things are made of rather than a vehicle through which they are made implies Pantheism over Trinitarian Monotheistic Creationism. Does that make sense?
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain " *** “We must realize that the Reformation world view leads in the direction of government freedom. But the humanist world view with inevitable certainty leads in the direction of statism. This is so because humanists, having no god, must put something at the center, and it is inevitably society, government, or the state.”- Francis A. Schaeffer “The whole war between the atheist and the theist comes down to this: the atheist believes a 'what' created the universe; the theist believes a 'who' created the universe.”
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Juvenissun Member (Idle past 60 days) Posts: 332 Joined: |
In order to argue about anything related to God, one first NEEDS to assume that there is a God. Otherwise, where is the base for any follow-up argument?
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Phat Member Posts: 14881 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: |
![]() But lets focus on you and I. Do you know what God would say were it He and I? Discuss. "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain " *** “We must realize that the Reformation world view leads in the direction of government freedom. But the humanist world view with inevitable certainty leads in the direction of statism. This is so because humanists, having no god, must put something at the center, and it is inevitably society, government, or the state.”- Francis A. Schaeffer “The whole war between the atheist and the theist comes down to this: the atheist believes a 'what' created the universe; the theist believes a 'who' created the universe.”
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ringo Member Posts: 18854 From: frozen wasteland Joined: Member Rating: 3.8 |
Well DUH. Evidence and reality ALWAYS trump belief. Always, always, always.
That's where your problem is. I don't believe that there is any more evidence for YOUR god than there is for any other god. YOU believe there is no evidence for the other gods. You just need to catch up by one god.
WRONG - as i have told you many times. Do you read my posts at all? I believe that human potential is all we have. Even if it's only a 1 on a scale of 1 to 10, it's all we have. Christians are living proof of that. "I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing
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ringo Member Posts: 18854 From: frozen wasteland Joined: Member Rating: 3.8 |
Obviously not. We can argue about Frodo without assuming that Frodo exists. "I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing
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ringo Member Posts: 18854 From: frozen wasteland Joined: Member Rating: 3.8 |
Your premise is false. It is certainly possible to discuss the nature odf a fictional entity, such as Frodo. "I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing
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Juvenissun Member (Idle past 60 days) Posts: 332 Joined: |
That is true. But in this Trinity issue, the question is NOT if God exists, but is "Is God one or three"?. Do you see God is already assumed to exist in the question? If you say: God does not exist. Then you can leave this thread alone. If you want to explore the Trinity, then you MUST assume at least one God exists. Can you see what you have to deal with in this issue is a logic question, not a theological question? You assume God exists, then we can talk about Trinity.
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Juvenissun Member (Idle past 60 days) Posts: 332 Joined: |
Sorry, I did not read early postings. I do not understand the question.
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Phat Member Posts: 14881 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: |
Basically I am asking if you as a believer can speak on behalf of God. Critics despise apologists because they claim that apologists make up random stuff and in essence claim to speak on Gods behalf. Philosophically I see no reason why you can't. Scientifically is another issue, however. Science is science and is based on testable logic. Even if God could change the rules of logic, it does not appear that He does so.
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain " *** “We must realize that the Reformation world view leads in the direction of government freedom. But the humanist world view with inevitable certainty leads in the direction of statism. This is so because humanists, having no god, must put something at the center, and it is inevitably society, government, or the state.”- Francis A. Schaeffer “The whole war between the atheist and the theist comes down to this: the atheist believes a 'what' created the universe; the theist believes a 'who' created the universe.”
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Phat Member Posts: 14881 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: |
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain " *** “We must realize that the Reformation world view leads in the direction of government freedom. But the humanist world view with inevitable certainty leads in the direction of statism. This is so because humanists, having no god, must put something at the center, and it is inevitably society, government, or the state.”- Francis A. Schaeffer “The whole war between the atheist and the theist comes down to this: the atheist believes a 'what' created the universe; the theist believes a 'who' created the universe.”
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Tangle Member Posts: 8054 From: UK Joined: Member Rating: 5.4 |
That's because you have no idea what philosophy is. Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona "Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android "Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
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Phat Member Posts: 14881 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: |
What color is the sky in YOUR world?
![]()
Instead of challenging everything with a counterpoint, perhaps you could explain why the points I make are PRATTs. "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain " *** “We must realize that the Reformation world view leads in the direction of government freedom. But the humanist world view with inevitable certainty leads in the direction of statism. This is so because humanists, having no god, must put something at the center, and it is inevitably society, government, or the state.”- Francis A. Schaeffer “The whole war between the atheist and the theist comes down to this: the atheist believes a 'what' created the universe; the theist believes a 'who' created the universe.”
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