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Author Topic:   Creation Vs. Evolution = Free will Vs. determinism
entwine
Inactive Member


Message 27 of 164 (127709)
07-26-2004 8:26 AM


I think God is as clueless as we are. The universe is only as deterministic as we allow it to be. And our free will is only as potent as the universe allows. I really believe there is a duality of function that allows us to know what we know when we know it and do what we do when we do it. It sounds stupid, but think about it. You can't do what you can't do and you can't know what can't be known. But it seems it's up to us to decide just what we know and do.

  
entwine
Inactive Member


Message 28 of 164 (127711)
07-26-2004 8:33 AM
Reply to: Message 21 by Hangdawg13
07-25-2004 9:44 PM


Hangdawg13:
quote:
You cannot possibly fathom omniscience.
And you can? Omniscience is a frozen bowl of jello; static, unchanging.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 21 by Hangdawg13, posted 07-25-2004 9:44 PM Hangdawg13 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 29 by Hangdawg13, posted 07-27-2004 3:10 AM entwine has replied

  
entwine
Inactive Member


Message 46 of 164 (130929)
08-06-2004 4:49 AM


A thought experiment: move your finger, ok now move another finger. Which finger did you move? Right pinkie, left index? How did you decide which to move? Did God tell you, did QM determine which you moved? Stimulus, thought, action; it doesn't get much simpler than that. I mean thought in the broadest sense, that point between stimulus and action. We are self-deterministic, but we do carry enough baggage to make even the most cynical doubt that.

  
entwine
Inactive Member


Message 47 of 164 (130930)
08-06-2004 5:29 AM
Reply to: Message 29 by Hangdawg13
07-27-2004 3:10 AM


hangdawg writes:
if God is imminent and transcendent, omniscient and omnipresent, then we have to remove the boundaries of time from our thinking, to get the first inkling of an understanding of his perception of things
As I said, Omniscience is a frozen bowl of jello; static, unchanging. To go further, to be imminent and transcendent means to be here and there inclusively. And to be omnipresent is to be at all places at all times not withstanding. And yes, time is a human construct, created by us to ensure that everything doesn't happen at once.
If God is as you say, it has, is and will happen, hence a frozen bowl of jello, no free will, no will at all. We will trundle on our appointed paths, play our part, all unknowing.
But we who live in this bowl of jello have found that we can move in unexpected ways, and God is happy for that.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 29 by Hangdawg13, posted 07-27-2004 3:10 AM Hangdawg13 has not replied

  
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