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Author Topic:   Who can be saved? A Christian perspective
Posts: 4001
From: Ontario, Canada
Joined: 12-02-2004
Member Rating: 2.5

Message 302 of 466 (532458)
10-23-2009 1:54 PM
Reply to: Message 297 by Phat
10-20-2009 4:52 AM

God the Overseer
Jar in the OP writes:

IMHO, as a Christian, anyone can be saved whether or not they acknowledge or profess a belief in Jesus or even GOD. In fact, even if they deny the existence of GOD they can and will likely be saved.

So to others out there, whether you are Christian, one of the other Judaic faiths, agnostic or even athiest, what do you think? Who can be saved and how do you support your position?

I am an atheist, so "saved" for me means "those who get to move into the better afterlife, if tiers exist there."

Who will be saved:
Pretty much everyone. Based on trying/wanting to be good. "Good" are those intellectually intentional actions that help or improve ourselves or others. "Bad" are those intellectually intentional actions that hurt or degrade ourselves or others. Since it is only based on our true motivations, only "God" (or some other amply endowed super-being) would be able to know.

How I support my position:
First, if there is no afterlife, the question is moot.
Second, if there is an afterlife, but it is not tiered in such a way that has a Heaven/Hell type of differentiation, the question is also moot.

This leaves us only considering those possible afterlifes where some divine-type being is in charge, and there are different tiered levels.

Now we have the identity of the divine-type being. What if he isn't just? If so, some good people will certainly get tossed into the bad-tier. Under such circumstances, the divine-type being isn't worthy of respect and therefore the afterlife he controls isn't worth worrying about.

So, what is a just divine-type being (God for short)?

A just God would have the following characteristics:
-doesn't care if you believe in him or not
-doesn't care if you worship him or not
-doesn't care if you hate him or despise him or "blaspheme" against him or not (in fact, "blaspheming" wouldn't really be possible since God really wouldn't care)
-the only thing that would matter would be whether or not you truly had motivations to be a good person, as described above

My basis for the above qualifications in a just God is that I myself am able to separate those issues and not care about such things as people believing in me, worshipping me, or having people hate and blaspheme about me. Since I don't care about such things, and the only God worthy of being respected is one who is superior, then the only afterlife worth pursuing is one governed by a God that also does not care about such things.

Of course, I think the chances of such a specifically detailed afterlife are rather slim at best. But, if we're talking about who should be saved and what sort of afterlifes with God-guardians overlooking them are worthy of respect, that's the one I think of.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 297 by Phat, posted 10-20-2009 4:52 AM Phat has acknowledged this reply

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