I'm asking - regardless of how I'm to spend eternal life, given the objections raised - why should I look forward to it?
*Ducks into nearby phone booth, calls God collect, and asks for instructions*
Phat,as God writes:
Modulous! My beloved son! So many questions! *chuckle*...(beams at Modulous)
For reasons I will explain, the concept of eternal life whichever way it is dressed up fills me with either horror or non-caring. If I had a choice I would not accept this offer. Can I not simply request to be sent into the dark absence of oblivion rather than suffering permanent consciousness? It seems highly immoral to force me to do the thing which I would loathe to do.
Phat,as God writes:
Naturally, I want all of my children to stick around for the adventures that begin after you die, but of course I am capable of granting you the option of ceasing to exist....but tell me why you would want such a choice? Are you simply tired and need some quiet sleep? Please understand that unless I change the laws of the universe, I can't really recreate you once you have chosen to cease to exist. Do you seem to believe that all that you were meant to accomplish has been done? And a question for you to ponder: What is Recreation?
An analogous question would be, if over the 40 years of owning the car, every single component had been changed (including the chassis, the engine, etc etc) - is it the same car?
Here is a couple more, along that vein: Did the owner of the car want the upgrade? Assume that the car is analogous to the human body/mind. Have we asked for the upgrades along the way? Were we willing to endure the discomfort that some of them may have temporarily caused? Do we know why we wish to upgrade ourselves, and do we have a goal in mind at the end of our life here on earth?
I perhaps could imagine some eternity where you get to struggle, face increasingly difficult challenges, with failures and successes, always challenged, made to question, filled with doubt and uncertainty; but even there I would hope there would be extended periods of unconsciousness.
The idea of eternal bliss, eternal satisfaction, eternal peace may be great for preteens dreaming of their first love, but not something anyone post adolescent would enjoy.
This brings up a few questions.
I can see what you envision, I think. We would be growing as humans in this afterlife abode. We would be challenged so that we could grow and learn. What I don't understand would be the failures...the doubts and uncertainties. Would we not have a better communion and understanding with GOD at this point? Whats the point of learning more about the universe, with the ability to journey farther, deeper, and longer...without the primary goal of Heaven, (aka eternal life version) which is to know and commune with God? Surely you don't expect Her to invisibly sit on the sidelines and cheer Her little created worms ability to grow and explore for no reason other than to know more.
The big question that remains here is why did God make people at all? If he isn't going to let any of them into heaven but only fundamentally altered copies somewhat based off of them, why not just make the copies that are fit for heaven in the first place? Why bother with creating beings with the sole intention of them coming to know him, and when they do so annihilating them in favor of a more pleasing replacement?
Good question! The analogy here could be a grand social event of extended timeframe. Were I invited to such an event, I would do several things. First, it would be proper to know the host of such an event. Lets say, for example, that my employer invited me to move to a new town. First, it would help if someone whom I actually knew in the company contacted me, as opposed to someone who represented the company but whom i did not know. Second, it would help to know if anyone else whom I knew and/or worked with would also be relocating. Thus, knowing the host, and knowing others who were also attending.
Lastly, what were my alternatives? In the case of Heaven, or eternal life, would I have the opportunity to enjoy eternal life elsewhere, perhaps a neutral land with no gods or demons present, either of themselves or in some of the people of this land.
If I simply ceased to exist, having no perception of regret, the entire argument becomes irrelevant in the first place.
Thus, this entire thread discussion is based on the premise that we humans will have some sort of option for continued existence in some place, doing something.
I am not asking you to trust me. I am challenging you to attempt to get to know me. I apologize if some of my sales force has not presented the options in an attractive manner. Perhaps by the time of your death, we will have had a chance to get to know one another. I dont think it fair for anyone to not have had the chance to get to know me somewhat, so there will be chances.
And as Phat, I obviously believe this to be true! Again, I assert that nobody should be forced into choosing a deal that they have no solid assurance of being attractive, wise, and freely chosen.
Those principles of Jesus and the apostles are as follows; Love for God and good to those around us, be they friend or foe, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, humility, and temperance; these as per the beatitudes of Jesus in Matthew and the fruit of God's spirit as per the apostle Paul in Gal 5:22 and 23.
Perhaps what Modulous may like to know is how has your relationship with God allowed you to know Him better? Has He only spoken to you through His Word or has there been certain lessons, revelations, insights, and reaffirmations of His involvement in your life?
In other words, why is this Master worth trusting? How have you grown personally through your communion with God?