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Author Topic:   What is needed for creationists to connect evidence to valid conclusions
jar
Member (Idle past 416 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 121 of 147 (446992)
01-07-2008 5:48 PM
Reply to: Message 118 by TheDarin
01-07-2008 5:34 PM


Re: Towards the topic
jar....those charts ARE THE most common image the EVOs have planted...you need to get out more.... or read more books...or visit zoos. Call your marketing folks...I'm not making this stuff up.
You are confusing the source. Evolution Scientists did not create those images. Those are not scientific charts, they are cartoons.
I don't doubt that they may well be the thing folk notice, but that is simply a matter of ignorance. That is not how science teaches the descent.
A scientific chart will show where the questions lie, where we are unsure, where questions remain. It will also include minor information like names and identification. Something like this.
Part of the problem IS ignorance in the general populus. They don't have a clue what the Theory of Evolution actually says.
So the question is "What is there about the evolution of modern man and the other modern apes from some earlier ancestor that you find hard to accept?"

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 118 by TheDarin, posted 01-07-2008 5:34 PM TheDarin has not replied

  
sidelined
Member (Idle past 5930 days)
Posts: 3435
From: Edmonton Alberta Canada
Joined: 08-30-2003


Message 122 of 147 (446993)
01-07-2008 5:52 PM
Reply to: Message 94 by TheDarin
01-07-2008 2:35 PM


Re: Towards the topic
TheDarin
Why is it that the EVO charts in the textbooks indicate an ape evolving into a man. One path. Not one into two?
Please present the title and authors of the book you are claiming show this if you can.
And High hopes for what? You can see clearly that I am not denying that evolution happens. You must have had high hopes that I would go atheist on you.
Well you can hardly make such a declaration without understanding what evolution is.
I cling to the watchmaker argument - and as far as God being the ultimate boeing 747 - the argument is null, because we have not been given the means to process the thought of something from nothing...so while god is the ultimate Boeing 747, where God came from is not even within my ability to compute...or yours.
The watchmaker argument is not even wrong.
But I can show you example after example after example of design and creation, and you cannot show me one mutation that results in something remotely resembling the look and intelligence of the human brain. It's convenient of those who have deceived you that it takes a million or so years to run a test on their theory.
You are bold to make claims on something you do not understand and even bolder to make claims of evidence you possess for your stance that you have yet to present.
I hope you see that my issue is with those EVOs that deny ID - you are blind.
You are fond off saying such things. Please tell us what you think Intelligent Design is and what makes you think that you have a better argument in support than those that before you have tried?

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Cold Foreign Object 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3069 days)
Posts: 3417
Joined: 11-21-2003


Message 123 of 147 (446995)
01-07-2008 5:57 PM
Reply to: Message 118 by TheDarin
01-07-2008 5:34 PM


Re: Towards the topic
jar....those charts ARE THE most common image the EVOs have planted...you need to get out more.... or read more books...or visit zoos. Call your marketing folks...I'm not making this stuff up.
Said imagery representing the claim of human evolution is more accurately known in creationist circles as 'evolutionary iconography'. It perfectly depicts what evolutionists believe: apes somehow morphed into men. It is the ultimate blasphemy against God and clearly indicates to any objective person that evolutionists are capable of anything.
Iconography shows the degree of hate and anger that evolutionists have towards God and the Bible. Like I said these persons are capable of anything.
Ray

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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NosyNed
Member
Posts: 9003
From: Canada
Joined: 04-04-2003


Message 124 of 147 (447004)
01-07-2008 6:47 PM
Reply to: Message 123 by Cold Foreign Object
01-07-2008 5:57 PM


The trick pony
Ray, you seem to have only one argument: Everyone who disagrees with you is deluded or lying. You've said your piece. How about something new or, perhaps, a detailed demonstration supporting your views instead of unfounded assertions.
Boring Ray, very, very boring.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 123 by Cold Foreign Object, posted 01-07-2008 5:57 PM Cold Foreign Object has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 125 by jar, posted 01-07-2008 6:49 PM NosyNed has replied
 Message 127 by Cold Foreign Object, posted 01-07-2008 8:47 PM NosyNed has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 416 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 125 of 147 (447005)
01-07-2008 6:49 PM
Reply to: Message 124 by NosyNed
01-07-2008 6:47 PM


Re: The trick pony
Or maybe, just maybe "The Paper!!!!!!".

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 124 by NosyNed, posted 01-07-2008 6:47 PM NosyNed has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 126 by NosyNed, posted 01-07-2008 7:59 PM jar has not replied

  
NosyNed
Member
Posts: 9003
From: Canada
Joined: 04-04-2003


Message 126 of 147 (447027)
01-07-2008 7:59 PM
Reply to: Message 125 by jar
01-07-2008 6:49 PM


The Paper
Mr. J. there will be no "paper".

This message is a reply to:
 Message 125 by jar, posted 01-07-2008 6:49 PM jar has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 129 by Cold Foreign Object, posted 01-07-2008 8:52 PM NosyNed has replied

  
Cold Foreign Object 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3069 days)
Posts: 3417
Joined: 11-21-2003


Message 127 of 147 (447041)
01-07-2008 8:47 PM
Reply to: Message 124 by NosyNed
01-07-2008 6:47 PM


Re: The trick pony
Ray, you seem to have only one argument: Everyone who disagrees with you is deluded or lying. You've said your piece. How about something new or, perhaps, a detailed demonstration supporting your views instead of unfounded assertions.
Misrepresentation is a bad idea, it indicates the inability to refute.
I have over 3000 posts - so you very well know my views.
Ray

This message is a reply to:
 Message 124 by NosyNed, posted 01-07-2008 6:47 PM NosyNed has replied

Replies to this message:
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arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1365 days)
Posts: 9069
From: god's waiting room
Joined: 05-21-2004


Message 128 of 147 (447042)
01-07-2008 8:47 PM
Reply to: Message 81 by Rahvin
01-07-2008 12:07 PM


Re: The Belief Stops Here
my troll post for the day:
Think of it this way:
1+1=2, right?
1+1+x=2 is also true.
Why do we not use the x every time we discuss 1+1? Because it must be equal to 0, and is thus not relevant. The simplest expression is preferred - that being, the expression with the fewest terms.
2x dx= x2+ c


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Replies to this message:
 Message 137 by RAZD, posted 01-08-2008 8:15 AM arachnophilia has replied

  
Cold Foreign Object 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3069 days)
Posts: 3417
Joined: 11-21-2003


Message 129 of 147 (447044)
01-07-2008 8:52 PM
Reply to: Message 126 by NosyNed
01-07-2008 7:59 PM


Re: The Paper
Mr. J. there will be no "paper".
This is just reverse psychology, which, in this case, is expressing interest in my work while telling me to hurry up. I am working as fast as I can and I thank you for expressing interest in reading my argument refuting evolution.
Ray

This message is a reply to:
 Message 126 by NosyNed, posted 01-07-2008 7:59 PM NosyNed has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 133 by NosyNed, posted 01-07-2008 11:43 PM Cold Foreign Object has not replied
 Message 135 by molbiogirl, posted 01-08-2008 2:24 AM Cold Foreign Object has not replied

  
Omnivorous
Member
Posts: 3985
From: Adirondackia
Joined: 07-21-2005
Member Rating: 7.2


Message 130 of 147 (447056)
01-07-2008 9:57 PM
Reply to: Message 123 by Cold Foreign Object
01-07-2008 5:57 PM


Re: Towards the topic
CFO writes:
Like I said these persons are capable of anything.
Yes, it's true--we can make assertions AND provide evidence for them!
Shocks the creationist conscience, does it not?

Real things always push back.
-William James
Save lives! Click here!
Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC!
---------------------------------------

This message is a reply to:
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NosyNed
Member
Posts: 9003
From: Canada
Joined: 04-04-2003


Message 131 of 147 (447072)
01-07-2008 11:37 PM
Reply to: Message 127 by Cold Foreign Object
01-07-2008 8:47 PM


Ray's Posts
I have over 3000 posts - so you very well know my views.
You actually have about 3 posts - repeated 1,000 times each.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 127 by Cold Foreign Object, posted 01-07-2008 8:47 PM Cold Foreign Object has not replied

Replies to this message:
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arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1365 days)
Posts: 9069
From: god's waiting room
Joined: 05-21-2004


Message 132 of 147 (447073)
01-07-2008 11:39 PM
Reply to: Message 131 by NosyNed
01-07-2008 11:37 PM


Re: Ray's Posts
math = inability to refute!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 131 by NosyNed, posted 01-07-2008 11:37 PM NosyNed has not replied

  
NosyNed
Member
Posts: 9003
From: Canada
Joined: 04-04-2003


Message 133 of 147 (447074)
01-07-2008 11:43 PM
Reply to: Message 129 by Cold Foreign Object
01-07-2008 8:52 PM


Re: The Paper
Of course we are very interested in reading the paper. Imagine being able to be one of the first 100 or so people to read an historic paradigm shifting surprise to the scientific community.
What you should be aware of is that some of us have read papers that are promoted by their authors as such astonishing novel contributions. They are overwhelmingly the work of utter crackpots that, if they are literate enough to be read at all are easily demonstrated to be as full of holes as swiss cheese.
Anyone who was actually interested in accomplishing what you claim would be anxious in the extreme to have your work examined as soon as possible to get help in finding flaws in it's presentation, evidence or reasoning. Hiding it, continually promising it without deliverying and braying about how marvelous it is are further characteristics of crackpottiness.
You might give thought to that. (or, more likely, you might not)
You also forget that many here find the most controversial and surprising things the most interesting. We actually are interested in reading such things. However, given the evidence of your 3 x 1,000 posts so far we are expecting to be disappointed and, at best, amused again.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 129 by Cold Foreign Object, posted 01-07-2008 8:52 PM Cold Foreign Object has not replied

Replies to this message:
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arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1365 days)
Posts: 9069
From: god's waiting room
Joined: 05-21-2004


Message 134 of 147 (447081)
01-08-2008 12:35 AM
Reply to: Message 133 by NosyNed
01-07-2008 11:43 PM


Re: The Paper
You also forget that many here find the most controversial and surprising things the most interesting. We actually are interested in reading such things.
i know i'm interested.
but i also am interested in UFOs, nessie, timecube, and bigfoot.
though i do recall a while back, i'd pester ray about every time he made a post. then he disappeared for a while. ray, i'm still curious -- i thought you'd canned it. when can i look forward to reading it?


This message is a reply to:
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molbiogirl
Member (Idle past 2663 days)
Posts: 1909
From: MO
Joined: 06-06-2007


Message 135 of 147 (447102)
01-08-2008 2:24 AM
Reply to: Message 129 by Cold Foreign Object
01-07-2008 8:52 PM


Re: The Paper
Oh my stars!
This is the first I've heard of any paper.
Ray, when will it be forth coming?

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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