Why are you still here Phat? I'm here because it fascinates me watching delusional people at work and wondering wtf? But you're convinced by this nonsense yet still doubt it so much that you have to constantly argue it. It's like you have to pit yourself against reality to prove your own delusion.
Just for the record and ignoring the faked, those 'manifestations' are likely to be real - that is felt as real by those that experience them - that is, the poor sods that experience them are so sucked in by the charismatic nonsense that's all around them that they really do experience it. But it's a mental disorder, ffs.
quote:Those who profess a belief in demonic possession, also referred to as possessive trance disorder, have sometimes ascribed to possession the symptoms associated with physical or mental illnesses, such as hysteria, Tourette syndrome, epilepsy, schizophrenia,conversion disorder or dissociative identity disorder. In its article on Dissociative Identity Disorder, the DSM-5 states, "Possession-form identities in dissociative identity disorder typically manifest as behaviors that appear as if a 'spirit,' supernatural being, or outside person has taken control such that the individual begins speaking or acting in a distinctly different manner." It is not uncommon to ascribe the experience of sleep paralysis to demonic possession, although it's not a physical or mental illness. The symptoms vary across cultures. Demonic possession is not a valid psychiatric or medical diagnosis recognized by either the DSM-5 or the ICD-10. The DSM-5 indicates that personality states of dissociative identity disorder may be interpreted as possession in some cultures, and instances of spirit possession are often related to traumatic experiences—suggesting that possession experiences may be caused by mental distress. Some have expressed concern that belief in demonic possession can limit access to health care for the mentally ill. Studies have found that alleged demonic possessions can be related to trauma.
That every religious nut down through the ages has claimed what they assert to be evidence when others look at it and just laugh.
Of course. What do you expect? Have evidences on religion like on sciences? That is ridiculous.
Evidences on faith is personal. I see evidences, and I try to share it with you. If you do not see, that is too bad. It is your loss, not mine. I see everything you see, but you do not see the most important thing I see.
All you people who think they have this thing you call freewill, can you tell me whether you feel capable of shooting a child in the head tomorrow? Forgetting whether our secular society and your god's justice systems would frown on it, could you do it?
A robot could do it - the very thing that you claim we would be if we had no free will. A psychopath could do it - they actually do possess free will; they are not hampered by any sense of inborn and learnt empathy, so if they wanted to, they could.
Personally my free will to do many of the things that are morally wrong - stealing, raping, pillaging etc - I am incapable of. I can't even covet an ox, that's how fettered I am. And I'm an atheist - the very devil!
Free will is a religious fiction.
I may not be able to do any of the things above, due to the constraints upon my freewill. But - I still have freewill and I do not think it is a religious fiction.
Because I can choose pink lemonade over white lemonade. Because I can choose to kill a baby or not to kill a baby. Because I can choose to take classes in school or play video games or go for a drive or hang out with friends and family. Because I can choose to say these words or those words when speaking. Because I can choose to try and be nice, or disregard other people's feelings on purpose.
Sure - empathy is one of the many, many things that constrains (to varying degrees) my ability to choose "whatever I want."
Freewill is more of a "in this situation vs. that situation" choice-out-of-available-options kind of thing. Not some sort of "if you can't choose one specific, detailed thing - then you cannot ever choose anything" binary nonsense. It just so happens that most people alive find themselves in situations where they do have available options and the ability to choose out of them.
When we have such choices, and the "choice" comes from the being and not controlled by external forces - we call this "having freewill." Even if we don't have "all options."
I didn't say I could casually kill a baby.
I know you didn't but that was my requirement.
If I mis-understood you, and you just meant that constraints exist upon our freewill, even though we still have freewill...