6 online now:	LamarkNewAge, Larni, PaulK, Percy (Admin), Tanypteryx, Taq
Newest Member:	ChatGPT
Post Volume:	Total: 916,466 Year: 3,723/9,624 Month: 594/974 Week: 207/276 Day: 47/34 Hour: 3/6

EvC Forum ⇒ Social and Religious Issues ⇒ Faith and Belief ⇒

Free will: an illusion

Thread ▼ Details

Email This Thread

Newer Topic | Older Topic

Author

Topic: Free will: an illusion

arachnophilia

Member (Idle past 1366 days)

Posts: 9069

From: god's waiting room

Joined: 05-21-2004

Normal Thread Display

Message 57 of 309 (321702)
06-15-2006 1:38 AM

Reply to: Message 52 by rgb
06-15-2006 1:17 AM

CAKE OR DEATH!

In such situation, have I given you "free will"?

no, you have not. people (even vampires) do not grant free will. you've just given someone a very easy and obvious choice. one that may, in fact, be against someone's personal preference.

lots of dictators stay in power this way -- they continually get re-elected by a legitimate democratic election. just with the stipulation that if you don't vote for them, you die. it's not a GOOD choice, but it is a choice. are you willing to die for what you believe?

but you are right in that it doesn't make god appear to be very fair. i personally do not believe in a hell. i'm not even sure about heaven.

I will give you money.

how much money?

(also, i ordered the vegetarian)

Edited by arachnophilia, : typo

This message is a reply to:
	Message 52 by rgb, posted 06-15-2006 1:17 AM		rgb has replied

Replies to this message:
	Message 64 by rgb, posted 06-15-2006 2:35 AM		arachnophilia has replied

arachnophilia

Member (Idle past 1366 days)

Posts: 9069

From: god's waiting room

Joined: 05-21-2004

Normal Thread Display

Message 65 of 309 (321723)
06-15-2006 2:50 AM

Reply to: Message 64 by rgb
06-15-2006 2:35 AM

Re: CAKE OR DEATH!

quote:
but you are right in that it doesn't make god appear to be very fair.

Hey, I never said that.

hmm. then i guess i must have.

This message is a reply to:
	Message 64 by rgb, posted 06-15-2006 2:35 AM		rgb has not replied

arachnophilia

Member (Idle past 1366 days)

Posts: 9069

From: god's waiting room

Joined: 05-21-2004

Normal Thread Display

Message 67 of 309 (321729)
06-15-2006 3:18 AM

Reply to: Message 66 by PaulK
06-15-2006 2:54 AM

Re: Topic = Freewill

Foreknowledge is only possible if the future is fixed

not to be a smartass, but why?

since one of the concepts in question here is god, supposing the existance of god, and that god is indeed omniscient, why couldn't his fore-knowledge include all possible outcomes. basically, what if god is an infinite quantum computer?

This message is a reply to:
	Message 66 by PaulK, posted 06-15-2006 2:54 AM		PaulK has replied

Replies to this message:
	Message 68 by PaulK, posted 06-15-2006 3:26 AM		arachnophilia has replied

arachnophilia

Member (Idle past 1366 days)

Posts: 9069

From: god's waiting room

Joined: 05-21-2004

Normal Thread Display

Message 69 of 309 (321733)
06-15-2006 3:42 AM

Reply to: Message 68 by PaulK
06-15-2006 3:26 AM

Re: Topic = Freewill

If there are multiple possible outcomes and God knows all of them then God can't meaningfully predict the future other than to say "one of these several things will happen..."

or rather, all of them. maybe the trick is destroying the universes that don't go your way?

This message is a reply to:
	Message 68 by PaulK, posted 06-15-2006 3:26 AM		PaulK has not replied

Date format: mm-dd-yyyy

Timezone: ET (US)

Newer Topic | Older Topic

Do Nothing Button