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Author Topic:   Claims of God Being Omnipotent in the Bible
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 6491
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.5


Message 266 of 381 (521961)
08-30-2009 11:02 PM
Reply to: Message 265 by JRTjr
08-30-2009 9:41 PM


Re: Good and Evil
So let me get this strait. You’re saying that; if someone twists and/or lies about what something or someone else says that that (in and of itself) invalidates what was originally said?

In other words, if I tell you the sky is blue but ten other people twist or lie about what I said; then what I originally said is not true?

So you know what was originally meant? You are privy to the "TRUTH"?
Why should we believe you and not someone else?


Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
This message is a reply to:
 Message 265 by JRTjr, posted 08-30-2009 9:41 PM JRTjr has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 269 by JRTjr, posted 08-31-2009 12:59 AM Theodoric has not yet responded

    
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 6491
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.5


Message 293 of 381 (528861)
10-07-2009 9:26 AM
Reply to: Message 291 by JRTjr
10-06-2009 10:26 PM


Re: Regarding Supposed Biblical Inconsistencies
Please read ‘The Case for Christ’ by Lee Strobel.

You cannot be serious. This book is one of the most blatant attempts by an apologist to present fallacy, distortion of evidence and gross misinterpretation to make "The Case for Christ".

I challenge you to read also Challenging the Verdict, Earl Doherty, Age of Reason Publications.

I have read both.

I do find it very interesting that most fundies demand non believers read all of their tracts, but refuse to read anything that counters their own beliefs.


Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
This message is a reply to:
 Message 291 by JRTjr, posted 10-06-2009 10:26 PM JRTjr has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 300 by JRTjr, posted 10-11-2009 6:18 PM Theodoric has responded

    
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 6491
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.5


Message 301 of 381 (530105)
10-12-2009 9:40 AM
Reply to: Message 300 by JRTjr
10-11-2009 6:18 PM


Re: Regarding Supposed Biblical Inconsistencies
I have not encountered anyone yet who, when properly using the ‘Rules of Interpretation’, have given me a provable error or contradiction in the Bible.

The mental gymnastics needed to this must be very painful. I have a feeling no matter what is presented you will not accept it.

Can you give us an example of the “fallac(ies), distortion of evidence and gross misinterpretation(s)”?

Oh here are a couple of his claims that Doherty touches on.
1) An unprecedented number of New Testament manuscripts can be dated extremely close to the original writings.

Truth
Small scrap of John is from early 2nd century, nothing else is before 200CE

2)Modern New Testament is 99.5% error free.
I guess this works for people who feel that their interpretation is the inspired interpretation.

Truth
There have been a lot of changes to the text.
Isaiah 7:14 used the word almah, which mean woman of a marriageable age.
A greek translation erroneously translated this as parthenos, which means virgin.
Matthew then used the wrong translation to claim a prophecy was fulfilled in Matthew 1:22-23.
Some translations use "virgin", some use "young woman". The correct translation is "young woman"


Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
This message is a reply to:
 Message 300 by JRTjr, posted 10-11-2009 6:18 PM JRTjr has responded

Replies to this message:
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 Message 307 by JRTjr, posted 10-22-2009 1:01 PM Theodoric has responded

    
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 6491
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.5


Message 310 of 381 (532351)
10-22-2009 10:18 PM
Reply to: Message 307 by JRTjr
10-22-2009 1:01 PM


Re: Regarding Supposed Biblical Inconsistencies
I’m not going to quote all of the evidence here (It world -and does- take up several books), however, the manuscripts, and pieces of manuscripts that we have for all of the parts of (what we call) the modern day Bible out number (by far) the number of manuscripts, and pieces of manuscripts that we have for any other ancient document or group of documents (that aren’t chiseled in or painted on stone).

You religious types love to just throw stuff up and see if it sticks.

Most of these "manuscripts" are just fragments.

Before the 9th century there is only one complete manuscript of the New Testament. It is the Codex Sinaiticus from the 4th century CE.
We are told repeatedly by fundies that that the number of New Testament manuscripts is 5664. Source:Lee Strobel, Case for Christ
Only 59 are complete or almost complete all but 3 date from 9th century CE or later.
All the rest are fragments. Some consist of only a few verses.

Now a lot of fundies love to compare this with the fact that the Iliad has only 643 surviving manuscripts. The problem here is that the Iliad is a single book by a single author. The numbers are not anywhere near impressive when you break down the New Testament to its individual books.

Contradictions in the bible.
I found these in The Rejection of Pascals Wager by Paul Tobin.

Who Conquered Hebron: Joshua or Caleb?
Who Slew Goliath: David or Elhanan?
Botany of the Mustard Seed.
What did Judas do with his 30 silver coins and how did he die?

These are contradictions.


Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
This message is a reply to:
 Message 307 by JRTjr, posted 10-22-2009 1:01 PM JRTjr has acknowledged this reply

    
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 6491
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.5


Message 317 of 381 (738151)
10-05-2014 10:43 AM
Reply to: Message 316 by djufo
10-04-2014 11:38 AM


The original texts were written in Sumerian cuneiform, in clay tablets, 3,000-8,000 years ago.

Please tell us where these tablets are kept so that we can look at them. Do you at least have a picture?


Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 316 by djufo, posted 10-04-2014 11:38 AM djufo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 322 by djufo, posted 10-08-2014 10:45 PM Theodoric has responded

    
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 6491
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.5


Message 325 of 381 (738348)
10-09-2014 8:54 AM
Reply to: Message 322 by djufo
10-08-2014 10:45 PM


Her are a few choice bits from your link.

quote:
One of the more compelling arguments for this is the fact that science has recently revealed that there probably was a global catastrophic flood that took place about 10,000 years ago.

Uh no, science has revealed no such thing
quote:
Many of these texts are fragmented and incomplete, making context difficult to piece together at times.

Hmm interesting, so how about someone showing us the parts that have been translated that say what is claimed.
quote:
It’s a theory that has been ruled out as quite simply preposterous by academics and peer reviewed Archaeologists around the world since it was first proposed. There are many Ancient Alien theorists who refuse to consider Sitchin’s contributions due to his lack of empirical evidence and the fact that his is a translation of the tablets that many Cuneiform experts do not agree with.

Ahh, his own "special" translation.

So basically you got nothing.


Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 322 by djufo, posted 10-08-2014 10:45 PM djufo has not yet responded

    
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 6491
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.5


(1)
Message 332 of 381 (738860)
10-16-2014 5:29 PM
Reply to: Message 331 by Thugpreacha
10-16-2014 4:46 PM


Re: Unable to meet God due to detached observer status
I guess those that "discipline" themselves to think critically realize that there is probably no supernatural. Cuz, if there were we would have some evidence. If evidence seems to appear we will reevaluate.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 331 by Thugpreacha, posted 10-16-2014 4:46 PM Thugpreacha has acknowledged this reply

    
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