Carico,
I hope Nuggin won't mind if I step in here.
So since I previously stated that I will not debate with an evolutionist if he contradicts himself, or takes back any staments,I have proven the theory of evolution a lie and this debate is over.
Nuggin did not contradict himself. He said humans breed with apes because humans are apes. He, & everyone else has been saying this all along. Quite how you think the consistency displayed by Nuggin is contradictory beggars belief.
So since I previously stated that I will not debate with an evolutionist if he contradicts himself, or takes back any staments,I have proven the theory of evolution a lie and this debate is over. But I must admit, it didn't take very long to prove evolution a lie, and by an evolutionist himself in a formal debate, no less.
Firstly, you did not "prove" evolution was false. Even if Nuggin got it completely wrong, it would have no impact on evolutionary theory. But Nuggin, as described above, has actually been perfectly consistent throughout.
You also keep saying something along the lines that humans can't breed with apes, they are therefore not apes. And once again, I have to repeat the sentiments of everyone who has replied to you that you have rudely ignored, including myself. This
does not preclude humans from being apes. A simple understanding of classification will expose what a ridiculous position this is.
Gorillas are apes, chimps can't breed with gorillas, therefore chimps aren't apes, according to your logic. Right? Given how many times this has been addressed one wonders if you bother reading replies. If not, why come here? The alternative is that you don't understand.
But working on the assumption that the second hypothesis is true....
Biological classification is based upon nested hierarchies. Another way of putting it is that you have a large box, inside which fit smaller boxes. Inside which fit smaller boxes until you hit the last hierarchy of boxes that contain species. Each of these hierarchies is given a name. Kingdom, phylum, class, order, family, genus, & finally species. This is not immutable, you get super orders & sub classes & so on. You may have several phyla in a kingdom, then several classes in a phyla & so on all the way down to the genus being able to have several species contained within it. Organisms are grouped based on what are called apomorphies. That is, shared derived characteristics. What we find is that organisms cluster into these nested hierarchies
because they share more apomorphies in common with each other than everything else.
Apes, including humans, share more apomorphies with each other than anything else, & so at that level they are grouped in the same taxonomic rank. In other words, humans are apes in exactly the same way that blue whales & moles are mammals. In exactly the same way that timber wolves & foxes are canines. In exactly the same way that ants & mosquitos are insects. In exactly the same way that sessile oak & sugar cane are flowering plants. You get the picture?
Because sugar cane can't breed with the oak does not mean it should be excluded from the angiosperms. Because ants can't breed with mosquitos does not mean they are not insects. Because foxes & timber wolves can't breed does not mean they aren't canines. Because moles can't breed with whales does not mean they aren't mammals.
A - N - D ...
Because humans can't breed with chimps does not mean they aren't apes.
The next highest taxonomic rank above species is the genus. Given that they are occupied by species, they
shouldn't be able to breed with each other.
Do you understand?
Mark
This message has been edited by mark24, 12-27-2005 07:09 AM
There are 10 kinds of people in this world; those that understand binary, & those that don't
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