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Author Topic:   If we are all descended from Noah ...
Peter
Member (Idle past 1479 days)
Posts: 2161
From: Cambridgeshire, UK.
Joined: 02-05-2002


Message 1 of 165 (10402)
05-27-2002 7:31 AM


If we are all descended from Noah, and Noah had not
only faith in the One God, but proof of his existence ...
Why are there religions other than judaism and christianity ?

Replies to this message:
 Message 2 by Quetzal, posted 05-27-2002 8:59 AM Peter has replied
 Message 4 by TrueCreation, posted 05-27-2002 1:08 PM Peter has replied
 Message 44 by acmhttu001_2006, posted 09-15-2002 10:38 AM Peter has not replied
 Message 160 by Adminnemooseus, posted 09-30-2002 12:57 PM Peter has not replied

Quetzal
Member (Idle past 5872 days)
Posts: 3228
Joined: 01-09-2002


Message 2 of 165 (10403)
05-27-2002 8:59 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by Peter
05-27-2002 7:31 AM


Just another example of god's plan for human fallibility as a result of the Fall of Man. Or words to that effect...

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Peter, posted 05-27-2002 7:31 AM Peter has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 3 by Peter, posted 05-27-2002 9:17 AM Quetzal has not replied

Peter
Member (Idle past 1479 days)
Posts: 2161
From: Cambridgeshire, UK.
Joined: 02-05-2002


Message 3 of 165 (10405)
05-27-2002 9:17 AM
Reply to: Message 2 by Quetzal
05-27-2002 8:59 AM


That's the sort of thing I'm expecting ... but one
always lives in hope

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2 by Quetzal, posted 05-27-2002 8:59 AM Quetzal has not replied

TrueCreation
Inactive Member


Message 4 of 165 (10416)
05-27-2002 1:08 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Peter
05-27-2002 7:31 AM


Contary to Quetzals input
it is the result of diverging cultures and isolated populations as generations pass and cultural biases and beliefs develop.
------------------
[This message has been edited by TrueCreation, 05-27-2002]

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Peter, posted 05-27-2002 7:31 AM Peter has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 5 by RedVento, posted 05-28-2002 10:57 AM TrueCreation has not replied
 Message 12 by Peter, posted 05-28-2002 7:14 PM TrueCreation has not replied

RedVento
Inactive Member


Message 5 of 165 (10466)
05-28-2002 10:57 AM
Reply to: Message 4 by TrueCreation
05-27-2002 1:08 PM


quote:
Originally posted by TrueCreation:
Contary to Quetzals input
it is the result of diverging cultures and isolated populations as generations pass and cultural biases and beliefs develop.

One question.. If that is the case how do you explain the existance of religions that predate the flood that are still around today?(Buddism & Taoism for example)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4 by TrueCreation, posted 05-27-2002 1:08 PM TrueCreation has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 6 by w_fortenberry, posted 05-28-2002 12:03 PM RedVento has replied
 Message 26 by dreaded s flynn, posted 06-08-2002 12:52 AM RedVento has not replied

w_fortenberry
Member (Idle past 6107 days)
Posts: 178
From: Birmingham, AL, USA
Joined: 04-19-2002


Message 6 of 165 (10477)
05-28-2002 12:03 PM
Reply to: Message 5 by RedVento
05-28-2002 10:57 AM


quote:
Originally posted by RedVento:
One question.. If that is the case how do you explain the existance of religions that predate the flood that are still around today?(Buddism & Taoism for example)
Another question... How do you know that Buddism and Taoism predate the flood?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 5 by RedVento, posted 05-28-2002 10:57 AM RedVento has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 7 by RedVento, posted 05-28-2002 12:19 PM w_fortenberry has replied
 Message 13 by Peter, posted 05-28-2002 7:16 PM w_fortenberry has replied

RedVento
Inactive Member


Message 7 of 165 (10478)
05-28-2002 12:19 PM
Reply to: Message 6 by w_fortenberry
05-28-2002 12:03 PM


quote:
Originally posted by w_fortenberry:
Another question... How do you know that Buddism and Taoism predate the flood?
Well I did a quick search to find out IF they did predate the flood, and cannot say they did, except for possible hinduism which originated 4000 BCE to 2200 BCE.. however the cultures that fostered these religions(Indian, Chinese) do predate the flood and as far as I know there is no mention of Judeism in their cultures after the "flood." So the question I should have asked is.. How do you explain pre flood culture and peoples that have not changed significantly directly pre-flood and directly post flood, or that there is no significant gap in cultures while the planet was being repopulated. I guess my real question is this.. how can I be expected to believe that the earth was repopulated by Noah and his family after an event that destroyed all life on the planet other than those chosen to survive on the Ark. That this select few then were able to repopulate the earth so quickly and still manage to diversify to the point that we now have 3 unique looking humans(Forgive the following):Black, White, Yellow, all with unique physical traits, from very different geographic locales.
[This message has been edited by RedVento, 05-28-2002]

This message is a reply to:
 Message 6 by w_fortenberry, posted 05-28-2002 12:03 PM w_fortenberry has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 8 by w_fortenberry, posted 05-28-2002 1:00 PM RedVento has replied

w_fortenberry
Member (Idle past 6107 days)
Posts: 178
From: Birmingham, AL, USA
Joined: 04-19-2002


Message 8 of 165 (10481)
05-28-2002 1:00 PM
Reply to: Message 7 by RedVento
05-28-2002 12:19 PM


quote:
Originally posted by RedVento:
Well I did a quick search to find out IF they did predate the flood, and cannot say they did, except for possible hinduism which originated 4000 BCE to 2200 BCE.. however the cultures that fostered these religions(Indian, Chinese) do predate the flood and as far as I know there is no mention of Judeism in their cultures after the "flood."
Allow me then to rephrase my question. How do you know that the Indian and Chinese cultures predate the flood?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 7 by RedVento, posted 05-28-2002 12:19 PM RedVento has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 9 by RedVento, posted 05-28-2002 2:05 PM w_fortenberry has replied

RedVento
Inactive Member


Message 9 of 165 (10490)
05-28-2002 2:05 PM
Reply to: Message 8 by w_fortenberry
05-28-2002 1:00 PM


quote:
Originally posted by w_fortenberry:
Allow me then to rephrase my question. How do you know that the Indian and Chinese cultures predate the flood?
Archeoligical records.
http://hawk.hama-med.ac.jp/dbk/chnpyramid.html has some interesting information about chinese pyramids and burial mounds, and links to more articles.
It is a bit harder to find stuff about India since I keep getting references to Indians and Indiana.. but I will keep digging.. its a slow day.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 8 by w_fortenberry, posted 05-28-2002 1:00 PM w_fortenberry has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 10 by w_fortenberry, posted 05-28-2002 2:17 PM RedVento has replied

w_fortenberry
Member (Idle past 6107 days)
Posts: 178
From: Birmingham, AL, USA
Joined: 04-19-2002


Message 10 of 165 (10492)
05-28-2002 2:17 PM
Reply to: Message 9 by RedVento
05-28-2002 2:05 PM


quote:
Originally posted by RedVento:
Archeoligical records.
http://hawk.hama-med.ac.jp/dbk/chnpyramid.html has some interesting information about chinese pyramids and burial mounds, and links to more articles.
It is a bit harder to find stuff about India since I keep getting references to Indians and Indiana.. but I will keep digging.. its a slow day.

The link you provided merely presented some dates without proving their validity.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by RedVento, posted 05-28-2002 2:05 PM RedVento has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 11 by RedVento, posted 05-28-2002 2:59 PM w_fortenberry has replied

RedVento
Inactive Member


Message 11 of 165 (10496)
05-28-2002 2:59 PM
Reply to: Message 10 by w_fortenberry
05-28-2002 2:17 PM


quote:
Originally posted by w_fortenberry:
The link you provided merely presented some dates without proving their validity.
Ok, check this one http://www.elore.com/Astrology/History/early.htm
It talks about the history of Astronomy.. I am not sure what you are looking for in terms of "validity" since I can say the same thing about the bible.. All it is is a bunch of stories, where is the validating evidence.. At least the pyramids of china can be carbon dated, the bible has to be taken at its word..

This message is a reply to:
 Message 10 by w_fortenberry, posted 05-28-2002 2:17 PM w_fortenberry has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 14 by w_fortenberry, posted 05-28-2002 10:27 PM RedVento has not replied

Peter
Member (Idle past 1479 days)
Posts: 2161
From: Cambridgeshire, UK.
Joined: 02-05-2002


Message 12 of 165 (10513)
05-28-2002 7:14 PM
Reply to: Message 4 by TrueCreation
05-27-2002 1:08 PM


quote:
Originally posted by TrueCreation:
Contary to Quetzals input
it is the result of diverging cultures and isolated populations as generations pass and cultural biases and beliefs develop.

But the whole of the human society would have been founded
by Noah's immediate family, for whom the existence of the One
God was a given fact.
ALL human societies would have this as their root. It would not
be forgotten, as it would leave extremely deep rooted biases.
IF we are all descended from Noah's family, approx. 4500 years ago,
that means that the Greeks, Druids, Phoenecians, Romans, Norsemen etc. just suddenly decided to make up big Pantheons of Gods.
They created religous systems, and mythology, from scratch that
were contrary to their founding father's KNOWLEDGE of what the
case actually was, and against the grain of all of the
deep rooted conventions that make up their whole thought processes.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4 by TrueCreation, posted 05-27-2002 1:08 PM TrueCreation has not replied

Peter
Member (Idle past 1479 days)
Posts: 2161
From: Cambridgeshire, UK.
Joined: 02-05-2002


Message 13 of 165 (10514)
05-28-2002 7:16 PM
Reply to: Message 6 by w_fortenberry
05-28-2002 12:03 PM


quote:
Originally posted by w_fortenberry:
Another question... How do you know that Buddism and Taoism predate the flood?
That is actually a very good question. Could you please tell us
how many years ago the flood happened, providing scientific
evidence to support your claim ?
Once you've given us that we can debate which cultures pre-date
the flood.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 6 by w_fortenberry, posted 05-28-2002 12:03 PM w_fortenberry has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 15 by w_fortenberry, posted 05-28-2002 10:31 PM Peter has not replied

w_fortenberry
Member (Idle past 6107 days)
Posts: 178
From: Birmingham, AL, USA
Joined: 04-19-2002


Message 14 of 165 (10520)
05-28-2002 10:27 PM
Reply to: Message 11 by RedVento
05-28-2002 2:59 PM


quote:
Originally posted by RedVento:

Ok, check this one http://www.elore.com/Astrology/History/early.htm
It talks about the history of Astronomy.. I am not sure what you are looking for in terms of "validity" since I can say the same thing about the bible.. All it is is a bunch of stories, where is the validating evidence.. At least the pyramids of china can be carbon dated, the bible has to be taken at its word..

You made the claim that certain cultures (Indian and Chinese) predate the flood. I am simply asking you what evidence your claim is founded upon. If that evidence is the carbon dating of the pyramids, please provide information on the tests performed to obtain that dating. If you have some other form of evidence, please present the details of that evidence. If you have made this claim without having any supporting evidence on hand, please admit so, find the said evidence, and resubmit your claims.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 11 by RedVento, posted 05-28-2002 2:59 PM RedVento has not replied

w_fortenberry
Member (Idle past 6107 days)
Posts: 178
From: Birmingham, AL, USA
Joined: 04-19-2002


Message 15 of 165 (10521)
05-28-2002 10:31 PM
Reply to: Message 13 by Peter
05-28-2002 7:16 PM


quote:
Originally posted by Peter:
That is actually a very good question. Could you please tell us
how many years ago the flood happened, providing scientific
evidence to support your claim ?
Once you've given us that we can debate which cultures pre-date
the flood.

I may get to that eventually. Right now I am merely curious as to why our good friend is so sure that certain cultures predate the flood.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 13 by Peter, posted 05-28-2002 7:16 PM Peter has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 16 by Dr_Tazimus_maximus, posted 05-29-2002 9:57 AM w_fortenberry has replied
 Message 17 by RedVento, posted 05-29-2002 10:32 AM w_fortenberry has replied

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