Message 129 of 221 (597092)
12-19-2010 4:13 PM
Reply to: Message 128 by hERICtic
12-19-2010 1:25 PM
Reconciling Crucifixion Accounts
According to Roman time, the day ran from midnight to midnight. The Jewish 24 hour period in the evening at 6 p.m. and the morning of that day began at 6 a.m. Therefore, when Mark asserts that at the third hour Christ was crucified, this was about 9 a.m. John stated that Christ's trial was about the sixth hour. This would place the trial before the crucifixion and this would not negate any testimony of the Gospel writers.
This seems suspect. I also cannot find a specific reference to such information regarding Roman time keeping; Wikipedia, however, does have this to say:
Wikipedia on Boundaries of the Day:
The Jewish day begins at either sunset or at nightfall (when three second-magnitude stars appear). Medieval Europe followed this tradition, known as Florentine reckoning: in this system, a reference like "two hours into the day" meant two hours after sunset and thus times during the evening need to be shifted back one calendar day in modern reckoning. Days such as Christmas Eve, Halloween, and the Eve of Saint Agnes are the remnants of the older pattern when holidays began the evening before. Present common convention is for the civil day to begin at midnight, that is 00:00 (inclusive), and last a full twenty-four hours until 24:00 (exclusive).
In ancient Egypt, the day was reckoned from sunrise to sunrise. Muslims fast from daybreak to sunset each day of the month of Ramadan. The "Damascus Document", copies of which were also found among the Dead Sea scrolls, states regarding Sabbath observance that "No one is to do any work on Friday from the moment that the sun's disk stands distant from the horizon by the length of its own diameter," presumably indicating that the monastic community responsible for producing this work counted the day as ending shortly before the sun had begun to set.
This doesn't address how the Romans particularly measured time, but it mentions a few traditions from the ancient world. Also, it mentions the Jewish measure of time. As the article says, Jewish days begin at Sunset and end at the following Sunset about 24 hours later. Now, Conspirator's statement regarding the Jewish reckoning of the day is horribly agrammatical, and I cannot really figure out what it is he is trying to say. It appears, though, that his information regarding the Jewish measure of the day is a little off. For starters, he mentions a 24 hour period, but then gives us a period from 6 p.m. to 6 a.m., which is only twelve hours. Also, any information about the reckoning of the day doesn't really help us figure out to what the terms 'third hour' and 'sixth hour' refer, since the measuring of hours could have begun with the morning (when the Sun rises), not necessarily the beginning of the day (when the Sun sets). The NRSV translates the phrases 'third hour' and 'sixth hour' in Mark and John, respectively, as 'nine o'clock in the morning' and 'about noon'.
Many problems arise trying to reconcile the different times of the trial and crucifixion as told in the different gospels. If, as John claims, Jesus was tried on the day before Passover, then, if Conspirator's reconciliation that both Mark's and John's times are accurate is true; it would mean a crucifixion on the morning of the Passover (using John's account of when the trial began, and Mark's timing for the crucifixion, which had to, obviously, take place after the trial). However, according to both Mark and John, Jesus was buried on the day of Preparation (Mk. 15:42; Jn. 19:31). If 'third hour' in Mark really refers to 9 a.m., as Conspirator claims, there is no way to reconcile the two accounts.
Check out Apollo's Temple!
Ignorance is temporary; you should be able to overcome it. - nwr
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| ||Message 128 by hERICtic, posted 12-19-2010 1:25 PM|| ||hERICtic has responded|
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| ||Message 130 by hERICtic, posted 12-19-2010 5:24 PM|| ||Jon has not yet responded|