Does prophecy support the Bible

Nope. It does not. Indeed I stated the following."The cashless society is simply the medium that allows the prophecy to be fulfilled. " The prophecy has not YET been fulfilled Paul. It is in the process of being fulfilled and all the signs are there. Much as good are barcoded (666) and as we move to a cashless society, we will be eventually be limited to commerce through the use of a debit/credit card. Once this is in place, and all information about a person (debit card, library card, Driver ID ect) is stored on a single card (for simplicity sakes) security problems will arise.All this is already happening.There is already great talk of microchip implants ( we already see them in animals ). With bluetooth and GPS, I dont see a future where every human does not have a chip in them. The benefits of human inplants are substantial. Imagine a crime occuring and you can pinpoint the precise location of a suspected criminal at the time of the crime. A person suffers a heart attack, the microchip detects it, and contact the ambulance service, all without the patiest having to lift a telephone. Every time a child gets abducted, its just more incentive to track the location of children.Not where you expected to be? | Information Systems & TechnologyThe link you need to see is the eery correlation between 666 and the barcode. The rest, you can ignore if you so please.Z

Y'know, it only took me 5 seconds to come up with the last time Paul refuted this nonsense. Funny thing was that I found the link by Googling "snopes barcode 666" and Paul's post came up 2nd on the returned list. Take a looky here:http://EvC Forum: Bible can predict the future!!! -->EvC Forum: Bible can predict the future!!!

No probs Dan, thank you very much.

Hehe, seems no agreement You see the Bible as written by Authors , mere men with no guidance from the Holy Spirit, I don't. The best way I cant describe it would be for a soldier to write about fighting in the trenches of budapest. If you've never held a gun, you wont be able to appreciate what he's talking about, but to another soldier who faught in the same war, it would be clear.In much the same way, Christians today can relate to Biblical authors about their relationship with God. We part company before that Dan. My point was that the entire Bible was not indended to be understood in one sitting. Indeed you have to be a Christian and have the Holy Spirit guide you to understand some a great deal of the text. Why ? This prophecy is pretty specific, even if we had no idea previously how it would look. We knew we would require the number of the beast to do commerce and that ALL people would have this number (not just in a concentration camp ect). What we wouldn't have known was that it would come in such an obvious, non concentration camp type scenario. Where previously it would be believed that some dictator would try force all people on Earth to get the number as a sign that they could trade, now we know its not the case.Now, since the invention of the bar code and subsequent dependancy on its use, we know the case is that the number is required for logistical reasons to do commerce. A much more subtle way to go about doing it. (I'll assume this is a typo.) Why read the Bible if you dont believe in prophecy ? Jesus prophecised. I agree Dan, read the Bible without any bias or preconceived notions. However when it prophecised that something would happen and this prophecy was specific, I see no reason to see if any historic events match the prophecy.Indeed with regard the the mark of the beast, I would have to be a great sceptic, not to take note of the coincidence...Z

It took you 5 seconds to find a false site.The Inventor of the barcode, GEORGE J. LAURER has a page.http://members.aol.com/productupc/He has a Q&A page there.Give it a read, look for the 666 section. I think perhaps he would have a better idea than your friend on his webpage.When you are finished, please come back here and tell me if its still a hoax ?Zhttp://members.aol.com/productupc/666quest.html

Guess what? It's still a hoax. You should've read the site you supplied more carefully where he said (emphasis in the original):

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Yes, they do RESEMBLE the code for a six.

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Note that he doesn't say that they ARE the code for six, and even puts emphasis on the fact that they only RESEMBLE it. For a better understanding see here:Page not found – Ed Rushman.Where it states:

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These are not actually read as numbers but rather are used to adjust the reader for orientation and size of UPC. If you were to read them as binary, they would be "101," which as we know is the number five, not six ("110" in binary). So the numbers they claim as sixes are actually fives, if you must read them as numbers rather than timing marks.

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or here:Page not found - AAA TECHNOLOGIESwhere it says (emphasis in original):

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These guard bars are not "6" and carry no information. Even if you don't believe that guard bars carry no information and insist on applying the code table, you have to determine whether the digit is on the left side or the right side of the symbol. That's because the sequence of bars and spaces are different depending on whether the digit is on the left of the symbol or the right of the symbol. The LEFT guard bar would have to be smallest space, smallest bar, smallest space, WIDEST BAR in order to be a "6". The guard bar on the left is actually space of undetermined wide (left side digit must always start with a space element), smallest bar, smallest space, smallest bar. That sequence of bars and spaces is undefined and is not a "6" even using the table. The middle guard bar is not on the left or the right ('cause it is used to divide the symbol), so it is undefined by the table.

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Now, can I trust this will be the last time we'll see this nonsense from you?

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You see the Bible as written by Authors , mere men with no guidance from the Holy Spirit, I don't.

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1) You're putting context before text again.2) Whether the authors were divinely inspired or not is immaterial to what I was saying here; either way, they are unavailable for interview.

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Indeed you have to be a Christian and have the Holy Spirit guide you to understand some a great deal of the text.

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You have to believe in it before you can believe in it?I'm trying to be nice on this count... the initial way this statement reads to me is "you have to have a vested interest in the truth of these words before they can possibly stand up on their own merits."

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Why ? This prophecy is pretty specific, even if we had no idea previously how it would look.

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It is indeed specific. It specifically mentions a mark on the hand, not the cereal box. It specifically mentions the number of the beast (666), not a much longer number that may or may not (see ae's posts) have three sixes somewhere in it.As I said earlier, interpreting "hand" as "cereal box (etc)" and 666 as a longer number to suit the real world example to which you are trying to fit it negates the prophecy. If the meaning can't be read from the text alone, the comparison to the real world example is invalid.

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(I'll assume this is a typo.)

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Don't. It's not.You're assuming the prophecy is true, in order to gain meaning from world events, and then saying "the prophecy is true because the meaning matches world events!"In other words, you are using the assumption that the biblical prophets were actually able to tell the future to show that the biblical prophets were actually able to tell the future.

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Why read the Bible if you dont believe in prophecy ?

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I don't believe that Reed Richards, Ben Grimm, and Sue and Johnny Storm went up in a rocketship and got hit by cosmic rays. I still read Fantastic Four.In addition, despite my problems with literal interpretation, I do think there is wisdom to be gained from the Bible. (If I have time later, I might start a thread on wisdom atheists can gain from the Bible. But devoting this much time to this thread is stretching me thin as is.)

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I agree Dan, read the Bible without any bias or preconceived notions. However when it prophecised that something would happen and this prophecy was specific, I see no reason to see if any historic events match the prophecy.

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But that's just it; it doesn't match without shoehorning the events onto the prophecy before trying to read the meaning from the prophecy.

Also for your edification see: http://www.virtualsalt.com/barcode.htm.

So you really think that John saw someone gettign an RFID chip implanted in his arm and mistook it for him having a barcode pasted on his forehead ?Here are the versesRev 13:16 And he causes all, the small and the great, and the rich and the poor, and the free men and the slaves,
to be given a mark on their right hand or on their forehead,
17 and he provides that no one will be able to buy or to sell, except the one who has the mark, either the name of the beast or the number of his name.("he" is the second beast)The only things needed is a way to make permanent marks on human skin and enforcers to prevent anyone without the mark trading. There is no need for any technology more advanced than tattooing for the markNote that the mark includes EITHER the name or the number. UPC Barcodes only have guard marks that resemble an ENCODED six, and have no provision to encode names - and they are not going to be put on foreheads or hands. So the Bible as good as tells us that the mark of the beast is NOT a UPC barcode.It is a mark on the right hand or forehead so it is not an RFID chip. They are not easily visible, and more likely to be implanted in an arm.It is not described as a means of personal identification, nor any sort of financial record so what use could it be in trade ?

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Jesus prophecised.

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Prophesied. Prof-eh-sighed.Sorry, just a huge pet peeve of mine. I can't stand seeing/hearing that word butchered.

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You are still to receive the mark of the beast Rei, you haven't yet received it. Our current system is however just a precursor to what will happen. Can you not see the similarities between a barcode and 666 and the cashless society we are moving to ? What will you do when the next logical step is to replace the credit card with a microchip ?

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You don't put barcodes on people - you put barcodes on objects. Barcodes store a unique inventory id number. This number could be 666 on at most one object, since it must be unique. Only a tatoo or other mark, to signify that you're able to buy or sell stuff (as the bible says will happen - not that the mark itself will be money) would require a single universal symbol.I will stress this again: The mark signifies that you're permitted to buy or sell - not that the mark acts as money. You're adding to the prophecy on your own accord.A computer chip does not leave a mark, unless you're referring to a scar (which would not be what allowed the buying or selling - noone would refuse to scan you if you can't see a scar). A computer chip to *permit* you to buy or sell would be completely illogical - far more work than it's worth.By the way, what maker of computer chips requires people to worship their image and performs miraculous signs? ------------------
"Illuminant light,
illuminate me."[This message has been edited by Rei, 11-25-2003]

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I agree!! That's why I said they returned in 1948 and were attacked yet miraculously defended themselves and took even more land. They were attacked again in 1967 and this time defeated their attackers in only six days.

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Pure propaganda. I recommend you read some of my comments to Percy on this subject, where I reference remarks from some of the writings of Israeli generals involved in the conflict. In short, Egypt had 80,000 troops who were not on combat-ready status on the border. Israel had 3 divisions, including 5 armored brigades, all high tech. The self-defense myth was created well after the war; you don't launch a 3-division attack without months of extensive planning and mobilization beforehand.------------------
"Illuminant light,
illuminate me."

Could youse guys stop with the "666" stuff already? Revelations predates the introduction of Arabic numerals into Europe by about a millenium - the original used the Greek equivalents of Roman numerals - zeta, digamma, and I forget the third one. Not "numbers", but letters, or even someone's initials. Read the book already, zealot!

HI,But you miss the point of prophecy. Prophets speak the word of God, when this was spoken there were no Arabic numbers YET but there would be when the prophecy was fulfilled! LOLWonderful thing this prophecy, God knows the future he knows that there will be such a thing as 666 in the future. Oops, I think I just gave Zealot an apologetic, ah well it is about time he had a decent apologetic anyway.Brian.

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Considering I'm dealing with people who think that the world was literally created in under a week.........

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I hope you're not lumping me in that group, Dan. I thought I've made it clear that I don't necessarily buy the young earth -- Just the young creature interpretation.