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Author Topic:   If Genesis is Metaphorical, what's the metaphor?
mikehager
Member (Idle past 6466 days)
Posts: 534
Joined: 09-02-2004


Message 20 of 168 (187553)
02-22-2005 4:43 PM
Reply to: Message 16 by crashfrog
02-22-2005 3:36 PM


If we're talking about the fall,
What I think to be the main story of Genesis (the fall) is one of maturation. The childish and innocent Adam and Eve learn the knowledge of good and evil for themselves, here exemplared by the symbolic act of eating the apple. They become aware of their sexuality.
Yet god the father had ordered them not to eat of the apple and gain the knowledge. How are they punished? They are sent from their home and from their father's direct care but not his love. Eve is punished by the bearing of children and all it entails and they must work to care for themselves and bring forth their own children.
The story of the fall is the story of becoming an adult and doing what adults do. The fall of Adam and Eve from grace is the same fall we all take. We grow, we learn and we leave our parents behind. Stories like Genesis remind us that others have gone on before and not to fear the path.
That's what myth is. It is a grand stage on which the smallest dramas of life are played out for us. In the end, Genesis, like all myths, is teaching us how to be human and that there is no finer thing to be.
The problems arise when the dressing is mistaken for the meal. It is not that there was a garden and an apple, but that we all lived in the garden and ate the apple, if we are adults. Assuming literal truth for these grand and powerful tales and to not understand what they are really telling us is to demean them. It is classic case of not seeing the forest for the trees.
This is not a direct reply to Crash, but I've typed it out and don't want to change who I'm replying to.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 16 by crashfrog, posted 02-22-2005 3:36 PM crashfrog has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 44 by crashfrog, posted 02-22-2005 9:52 PM mikehager has replied
 Message 69 by nator, posted 02-25-2005 9:01 AM mikehager has replied

  
mikehager
Member (Idle past 6466 days)
Posts: 534
Joined: 09-02-2004


Message 23 of 168 (187571)
02-22-2005 6:50 PM
Reply to: Message 21 by Jor-el
02-22-2005 6:32 PM


Yes
I do deny that faith is needed to get value out of the bible, and I deny that any more value is gained with faith. In fact, the value is diminished.
Their value is the same as any other mythology, all are of equal value. To think one is inherently of greater truth when all convey the same message is nonsensical.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 21 by Jor-el, posted 02-22-2005 6:32 PM Jor-el has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 25 by Jor-el, posted 02-22-2005 6:56 PM mikehager has replied

  
mikehager
Member (Idle past 6466 days)
Posts: 534
Joined: 09-02-2004


Message 33 of 168 (187587)
02-22-2005 7:36 PM
Reply to: Message 25 by Jor-el
02-22-2005 6:56 PM


Re: Yes
I agree that isn't how christianity works. That's it's main problem and why I left it when I gained knowledge. That of course harkens back to genesis also.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 25 by Jor-el, posted 02-22-2005 6:56 PM Jor-el has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 36 by Jor-el, posted 02-22-2005 8:06 PM mikehager has replied

  
mikehager
Member (Idle past 6466 days)
Posts: 534
Joined: 09-02-2004


Message 41 of 168 (187601)
02-22-2005 8:36 PM
Reply to: Message 36 by Jor-el
02-22-2005 8:06 PM


Re: Yes
The faith is in you, not in the book or it's words. People have faith, not inanimate objects or even ideas.
Do not make the mistake of imparting anything more to the bible and it's stories then is there. That is exactly what I meant when I refferred to literalists missing the forest for the trees.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 36 by Jor-el, posted 02-22-2005 8:06 PM Jor-el has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 53 by Jor-el, posted 02-23-2005 2:11 PM mikehager has replied

  
mikehager
Member (Idle past 6466 days)
Posts: 534
Joined: 09-02-2004


Message 46 of 168 (187648)
02-23-2005 12:45 AM
Reply to: Message 44 by crashfrog
02-22-2005 9:52 PM


Re: If we're talking about the fall,
Thank you.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 44 by crashfrog, posted 02-22-2005 9:52 PM crashfrog has not replied

  
mikehager
Member (Idle past 6466 days)
Posts: 534
Joined: 09-02-2004


Message 54 of 168 (187810)
02-23-2005 2:27 PM
Reply to: Message 53 by Jor-el
02-23-2005 2:11 PM


Re: Yes
And where will faith without the guidance of the bible (Gods word)take you?
In the end to the same place you get with it.
At best you will get Anthropomorphism or a plurideistic culture. We as humans left that ages ago.
You are engaging in the error and hubris of thinking that your myths are better then any others. They work for you, and any other claim is unsupportable. You are going even further and committing the greater error that your myths are objectively real.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 53 by Jor-el, posted 02-23-2005 2:11 PM Jor-el has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 59 by Jor-el, posted 02-23-2005 3:50 PM mikehager has not replied

  
mikehager
Member (Idle past 6466 days)
Posts: 534
Joined: 09-02-2004


Message 74 of 168 (188494)
02-25-2005 11:58 AM
Reply to: Message 69 by nator
02-25-2005 9:01 AM


Re: If we're talking about the fall,
I got a policy about that. She likes it down, she can leave it down. I like it up, I'll leave it up. Why is her desire of greater value then mine?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 69 by nator, posted 02-25-2005 9:01 AM nator has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 75 by purpledawn, posted 02-25-2005 2:20 PM mikehager has not replied
 Message 77 by nator, posted 02-25-2005 6:39 PM mikehager has replied

  
mikehager
Member (Idle past 6466 days)
Posts: 534
Joined: 09-02-2004


Message 78 of 168 (188581)
02-25-2005 6:46 PM
Reply to: Message 77 by nator
02-25-2005 6:39 PM


Re: If we're talking about the fall,
Some men use the seat all the time. Me, for instance. I have a bad back and my physician has forbidden me from lifting heavy objects.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 77 by nator, posted 02-25-2005 6:39 PM nator has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 101 by Trae, posted 03-04-2005 6:33 AM mikehager has not replied

  
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