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Author Topic:   Where did the Egyptians come from ?
compmage
Member (Idle past 5470 days)
Posts: 601
From: South Africa
Joined: 08-04-2005


Message 71 of 112 (15245)
08-12-2002 2:17 AM
Reply to: Message 68 by halcyonwaters
08-11-2002 7:18 PM


quote:
Originally posted by halcyonwaters:

Given the circumference of the circle 30 cubits, divided by pi = 9.549, which rounds to ten cubits. The actual circumference would be 29.86 - 30.4 cubits, and the actual diameter would be between 9.5 and 9.68 cubits.

Except that you are assuming the circumference was the most accurate messurement. Lets try it this way; Given the diameter of 10, multiplied by 3.14 (for simplicity), that gives a circumference of 31.4 cubits.
Given that it is far simpler to measure the diameter than the circumference I think that my scenario is more likely.
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compmage

This message is a reply to:
 Message 68 by halcyonwaters, posted 08-11-2002 7:18 PM halcyonwaters has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 72 by halcyonwaters, posted 08-12-2002 3:09 AM compmage has replied

  
compmage
Member (Idle past 5470 days)
Posts: 601
From: South Africa
Joined: 08-04-2005


Message 73 of 112 (15335)
08-13-2002 1:53 AM
Reply to: Message 72 by halcyonwaters
08-12-2002 3:09 AM


quote:
Originally posted by halcyonwaters:

Isn't this some sort of pit? I would think it would be hard to measure the diameter. Anyhow, it doesn't make a difference. If I measure the diameter at 9.5, I write down ten, and get a circumference that rounds to 30. There is no problem here.

You are right, there is no problem. The Bible is not inerrent. This means that you are free to interpret any passage to suite your needs, whatever they may be. However, that does mean that quoting from the Bible has about as much merit as quoting from Alice in Wonderland.
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compmage

This message is a reply to:
 Message 72 by halcyonwaters, posted 08-12-2002 3:09 AM halcyonwaters has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 74 by halcyonwaters, posted 08-13-2002 1:45 PM compmage has replied

  
compmage
Member (Idle past 5470 days)
Posts: 601
From: South Africa
Joined: 08-04-2005


Message 76 of 112 (15408)
08-14-2002 2:06 AM
Reply to: Message 74 by halcyonwaters
08-13-2002 1:45 PM


quote:
Originally posted by halcyonwaters:

I'm not interpreting passages to meet my needs -- I'm using two pints of judgement and a pinch of common sense.

Is the true meaning of the passage (or any other) therefore a judgement call? How is that not interpretation? How often do you use this method to resolves apparrent contradictions in the Bible?
quote:
Originally posted by halcyonwaters:

God: Oh compmage, why did you doubt me for so long?
Compmage: Partly because you rounded numbers off in the Bible.

How about...
God: Oh compmage, why did you doubt me?
compmage: Well you didn't leave me much choice. A Bible that reads like bad fiction and no evidence pointing in your direction. Didn't give me much to go on there.
God: Now that you mention it I don't think I would have believed in me either.
------------------
compmage

This message is a reply to:
 Message 74 by halcyonwaters, posted 08-13-2002 1:45 PM halcyonwaters has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 77 by halcyonwaters, posted 08-14-2002 3:49 AM compmage has not replied

  
compmage
Member (Idle past 5470 days)
Posts: 601
From: South Africa
Joined: 08-04-2005


Message 83 of 112 (15462)
08-15-2002 2:25 AM
Reply to: Message 79 by halcyonwaters
08-14-2002 2:38 PM


quote:
Originally posted by halcyonwaters:

You're right, a much better word is logic. But judgement can be used too, if guided by the Lord. We are told not to cast our pearls before swine. We must use judgement in this case. This is a very spiritual matter, so I'll just stick to logic!

How do you know that you are being guided by the Lord? Who's to say it isn't the devil guiding you, or your own desire/need to have the Bible say x or y?
quote:
Originally posted by halcyonwaters:

My logic is based on the rest of the Bible. I see that elsewhere, God hasn't been concerned with precise numbering of years and measurments. How old was Adam? The Bible says 930 years. The Bible gives the ages of several people. Should I assume God meant to say everyone died on their birthday? If we found the Ark, and it was 50.5 cubits wide, instead of 50... would people call it a contradiction too?

Personally I don't give a damb if the Bible rounds numbers off or not.
quote:
Originally posted by halcyonwaters:

Because it makes for interesting study, don't you think?

No, not really.
quote:
Originally posted by halcyonwaters:

One of the greatest blessings for me is the Skeptic's Annotated Bible / Quran / Book of Mormon -- I get a kick out of seeing a problem or contradiction, studying the Bible, and arriving at an answer.

And how are we to know that your interpretation is any more valid than someone elses? YOu could be right, but so could they. Hell, maybe you're both wrong and someone else entirely has the answer.
quote:
Originally posted by halcyonwaters:

Now, why are there so many different interpretations? I don't know. The important verses are *very* clear though. I can accept I don't understand everything there is that is going on. In some cases though, it's the sin of man that gets in the way. People going in with ideas already in their head. A great example, is people who want the Bible to say that Homosexuality isn't a sin. It clearly does...
Actually, I think an even better example, is people who want the Bible to allow for evolution. It clearly does not. The only reason people think so, is they have gone in with existing ideas, and tried to make scripture fit man's ideas.

And why should I support your interpretation over theirs? What if you are wrong and they are right?
quote:
Originally posted by halcyonwaters:

With an open heart, honesty, and prayer, I absolutely am comfortable judging. I would be uncomfortable, if I went in trying to make it say something that it did not. (i.e. the examples above.) I am also comfortable using logic when studying His word.

Again. How do you know that what you think the Bible says is the right interpretation? Did God tell you? Are you sure it was God speaking?
------------------
compmage

This message is a reply to:
 Message 79 by halcyonwaters, posted 08-14-2002 2:38 PM halcyonwaters has not replied

  
compmage
Member (Idle past 5470 days)
Posts: 601
From: South Africa
Joined: 08-04-2005


Message 84 of 112 (15463)
08-15-2002 2:26 AM
Reply to: Message 79 by halcyonwaters
08-14-2002 2:38 PM


quote:
Originally posted by halcyonwaters:

You're right, a much better word is logic. But judgement can be used too, if guided by the Lord. We are told not to cast our pearls before swine. We must use judgement in this case. This is a very spiritual matter, so I'll just stick to logic!

How do you know that you are being guided by the Lord? Who's to say it isn't the devil guiding you, or your own desire/need to have the Bible say x or y?
quote:
Originally posted by halcyonwaters:

My logic is based on the rest of the Bible. I see that elsewhere, God hasn't been concerned with precise numbering of years and measurments. How old was Adam? The Bible says 930 years. The Bible gives the ages of several people. Should I assume God meant to say everyone died on their birthday? If we found the Ark, and it was 50.5 cubits wide, instead of 50... would people call it a contradiction too?

Personally I don't give a damb if the Bible rounds numbers off or not.
quote:
Originally posted by halcyonwaters:

Because it makes for interesting study, don't you think?

No, not really.
quote:
Originally posted by halcyonwaters:

One of the greatest blessings for me is the Skeptic's Annotated Bible / Quran / Book of Mormon -- I get a kick out of seeing a problem or contradiction, studying the Bible, and arriving at an answer.

And how are we to know that your interpretation is any more valid than someone elses? YOu could be right, but so could they. Hell, maybe you're both wrong and someone else entirely has the answer.
quote:
Originally posted by halcyonwaters:

Now, why are there so many different interpretations? I don't know. The important verses are *very* clear though. I can accept I don't understand everything there is that is going on. In some cases though, it's the sin of man that gets in the way. People going in with ideas already in their head. A great example, is people who want the Bible to say that Homosexuality isn't a sin. It clearly does...
Actually, I think an even better example, is people who want the Bible to allow for evolution. It clearly does not. The only reason people think so, is they have gone in with existing ideas, and tried to make scripture fit man's ideas.

And why should I support your interpretation over theirs? What if you are wrong and they are right?
quote:
Originally posted by halcyonwaters:

With an open heart, honesty, and prayer, I absolutely am comfortable judging. I would be uncomfortable, if I went in trying to make it say something that it did not. (i.e. the examples above.) I am also comfortable using logic when studying His word.

Again. How do you know that what you think the Bible says is the right interpretation? Did God tell you? Are you sure it was God speaking?
------------------
compmage

This message is a reply to:
 Message 79 by halcyonwaters, posted 08-14-2002 2:38 PM halcyonwaters has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 85 by halcyonwaters, posted 08-15-2002 5:59 AM compmage has replied

  
compmage
Member (Idle past 5470 days)
Posts: 601
From: South Africa
Joined: 08-04-2005


Message 90 of 112 (15507)
08-16-2002 2:08 AM
Reply to: Message 85 by halcyonwaters
08-15-2002 5:59 AM


quote:
Originally posted by halcyonwaters:

I put faith in a God that has revealed the truth about the world to me. You put faith in random chemical processes. In other words, your truth, ultimately comes from an accident. How can you rely on that?

I am questioning the basis of you faith. You can't then use faith to justify faith, it is circular.
When did I say I put faith in random chemical processes? What exactly is a random chemical process? If I take hydrogen and oxygen and introduce a spark I get water and if I do it again I get water again. Provided the environment doesn't change I will always get water. How is that random?
quote:
Originally posted by halcyonwaters:

How do you know you're not insane. We're all laughing at you, while you think a conversation is taking place. How do you know everything you say is gibberish to us? How do you know you're not in the Matrix

I don't. However, I have not seen any evidence to suggest that either of these are true. This is not that same as thinking that you have recieved guidence and assuming that it came from God so why bother asking the question when the situations are completely different. Assuming something exists without evidence is not the same as assuming it doesn't exists until you have evidence to the contrary.
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compmage

This message is a reply to:
 Message 85 by halcyonwaters, posted 08-15-2002 5:59 AM halcyonwaters has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 91 by halcyonwaters, posted 08-16-2002 8:20 AM compmage has not replied

  
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