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Author Topic:   The Unacknowledged Accuracy of Genesis 1
Jaderis
Member (Idle past 3447 days)
Posts: 622
From: NY,NY
Joined: 06-16-2006


Message 162 of 302 (408187)
07-01-2007 5:25 AM
Reply to: Message 159 by IamJoseph
07-01-2007 2:35 AM


Names are scientifically provable of its historical authenticity of time and place, and I doubt if Rings can pass such a test. The name Abram applies to a pre-canaan spacetime, while the name Abraham/Avraham/Ibrahim is post-Abraham. This makes the significance of listing pages of generation names, after Abraham, Isaac, Ishmael, Jacob, Esau and a host of other key figures - at first appearing as superflous - but in fact one of the strongest proofs of ancient writings' veracity.
All this proves is that the people propogating the myths lived in a specific area and time.
The Grecian epic poems Iliad and Odyssey and the comprehensive mythologies in the Bibliotheca describe real places and use names and language consistent with the time it was written down (and are dated to well before the first known texts of the Old Testament) and may very well have some basis in actual history (this is as highly debated as events in the OT among certain archaeologists and historians), but they also tell tales of supernatural creation, divine (and/or divinely supported) heroes and villains, god(desse)s intervening in human affairs,etc, and are at best considered legends exaggerated and embellished by generations of oral transmission.
What makes the OT any different?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 159 by IamJoseph, posted 07-01-2007 2:35 AM IamJoseph has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 163 by IamJoseph, posted 07-01-2007 5:33 AM Jaderis has replied

Jaderis
Member (Idle past 3447 days)
Posts: 622
From: NY,NY
Joined: 06-16-2006


Message 165 of 302 (408194)
07-01-2007 6:48 AM
Reply to: Message 163 by IamJoseph
07-01-2007 5:33 AM


The Illiad is a poem, dealing with mythical hellenist dieties
Yes and the OT deals with a mythical Hebraic deity, your point?
and is not older than the OT
Dead Sea Scrolls dated to no earlier than the second century BCE
its dating is without any substantiation
You sure about that?
An outline of Greek History including possible dates for the original writings of Homer
Wikipedia pagedetailing the pottery of ancient Greece, many pieces of which depict events described in Homer's writings (which do not prove the events to be true, but merely provide evidence for when the tales were written).
Page outlining Greek playwrights whose works are dated to the 5th and 6th centuries BCE and use Homer's writings and other Greek myths as plot points and backdrop.
Socrates and Plato (and other ancient Greek philosophers) spoke about (and against) the prevailing myths of the day (including those written by Homer since they are mentioned by name which indicates that they were prevalent in society and, in the case of the epic poems at least, written down.
with no hard-copy
Schoyen collection of Hesiod texts
Columbia University site with links to ancient papyri texts, including ancient Greek texts.
It does not site verifiable items.
I never said they do, but the historicity of some of the events (the Trojan War, for example) described (but not necessarily the details) have been shown to have some possible basis in truth (i.e. an embellishment of events happening centuries before which have turned into fanciful legends depicting divine beings and divine happenings).
So, again, what is the difference between the written legends and "histories" of the ancient Greeks and the written legends and "histories"of the ancient Hebrews?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 163 by IamJoseph, posted 07-01-2007 5:33 AM IamJoseph has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 168 by IamJoseph, posted 07-01-2007 8:03 AM Jaderis has not replied
 Message 171 by IamJoseph, posted 07-01-2007 8:31 AM Jaderis has replied

Jaderis
Member (Idle past 3447 days)
Posts: 622
From: NY,NY
Joined: 06-16-2006


Message 178 of 302 (408226)
07-01-2007 10:08 AM
Reply to: Message 171 by IamJoseph
07-01-2007 8:31 AM


The scrolls represent a recent find and regarded the oldest alphabetical books. But these are backed by much earlier datings from other archeological finds, including the Tel Dan find - which makes king david a real 3000 year figure, who wrote the psalms. The psalms contain numerous mentions of Moses and direct lift-off verses from the OT. aligning with its entire narratives.
The Tel Dan (and Mesha Stele) finds are hardly evidence that the biblical King David existed or that anything attributed to him in the OT ever actually happened as stated (or when), including the writing of most of the Psalms.
Just like any evidence for the existence for an historical Homer or Odysseus or an historical city of Troy does not mean that any events depicted in the Homeric Epics are actually true as presented.
There is also an egyptian manuscript which mentions Israel, dated over 3000 years. With regard archeological finds, I can post 100s of evidences continually unearthed in Palestine, including artifacts from the first and second temple period.
Please do. I'm sure many here would love to see such "evidences."
This is getting way off-topic here, though and I won't continue in this thread, so please propose a new topic.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 171 by IamJoseph, posted 07-01-2007 8:31 AM IamJoseph has not replied

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