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Author Topic:   Prophecy
drummachine
Inactive Member


Message 1 of 19 (36852)
04-12-2003 7:21 PM


AdminPamboli,
Here is one site I've been looking at. I know that there have been Christians that have made false prophecies and thats why Jesus Christ himself said no man knows the day or hour.
Here is the site No webpage found at provided URL: http://www.adishakti.org/prophecies/prophecy_25.htm#grandfather
Among the Lakota, the Crow, the Chippewa and other Native American tribes, the White Buffalo is one of the most sacred symbols. It represents purity, sacrifice and a sign that prophecy is being fulfilled. The Messiah honored by the Lakota Sioux is the White Buffalo Calf Woman who brought the Sacred Pipe and established the foundation of their ritual and social life. When she left, she turned into a white buffalo and promised some day to return. In 1994 a white buffalo calf was born in Wisconsin; in 1996 another was born in South Dakota. For the native peoples these births have been a sign to "mend the hoop" of the nations, to establish brotherhood within the family of man, and return to a spiritual way of life. (SI) Sept. 96, p.14)
The White Buffalo Calf Woman turned into a white buffalo!
We are entering a time of purification and can expect to witness chaos and destruction in all the kingdoms of nature. It is a time for the reuniting of the races. Barriers of religion and nationality will begin to fall as all people realize their essential unity. We must heal the damage done to Mother Earth, the source of life, and recognize that all living things are endowed with spirit. In the coming times we will see the return of one or more Great Teachers who will guide us into the future.
When I see things like this it is very sad. Restoring everything to "Mother Earth!"
Christ said there will be many false prophets and christs.
Believing that the(matter) is alive is Pantheism. Its the core of Hinduism. But Jesus Christ said he is out of time and he created everything out of nothing.
[This message has been edited by drummachine, 04-12-2003]

Replies to this message:
 Message 2 by Coragyps, posted 04-12-2003 7:49 PM drummachine has replied
 Message 3 by Brian, posted 04-12-2003 7:56 PM drummachine has replied

  
Coragyps
Member (Idle past 734 days)
Posts: 5553
From: Snyder, Texas, USA
Joined: 11-12-2002


Message 2 of 19 (36855)
04-12-2003 7:49 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by drummachine
04-12-2003 7:21 PM


Drum, what gives you any rational reason to prefer your particular mythology over the Lakota mythology? Not your personal preference, but a rational reason? Do you suppose that perhaps it makes a Lakota elder very sad when he sees the apocolyptic mishmash that fundamentalist Christians put out, claiming that there's some reward for a few of them in some undisclosed spot that isn't on Mother Earth?
I can see no reason to choose either of these mythologies. The Lakota at least have a buffalo to look at - a fairly unequivocal something. But "the End Times" have been at hand continuously, for one or the other of you guys' sects, for about 400 years now without anything happening. Doesn't that make you wonder just a little?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by drummachine, posted 04-12-2003 7:21 PM drummachine has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 4 by drummachine, posted 04-12-2003 8:26 PM Coragyps has replied

  
Brian
Member (Idle past 4959 days)
Posts: 4659
From: Scotland
Joined: 10-22-2002


Message 3 of 19 (36856)
04-12-2003 7:56 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by drummachine
04-12-2003 7:21 PM


Why is it sad to restore things to mother earth, worshipping nature is, after all, the oldest religion in the world.
If you want any evidence of a false Christ then Jesus is as good an example of a failure as any of the other Christs. Jesus actually didnt achieve a thing, Paul was far more influential and if you want an old testament messiah then David is streets ahead of Jesus.
Also,pantheism is not the core of Hinduism. Hinduism is a monotheistic faith, again you post without checking your sources.
You also take for granted that we know for sure anything that Jesus was supposed to have said, the fact that Jesus left no writings should make you take any attribution of anything to him with a pinch of salt.
Speaking of prophecy let us see the textual and intellectual gymnastics required to deal with this prophecy from the Jesus character.
Mat 16:28 I tell you the truth, some who are standing here will not taste death before they see the Son of Man coming in his kingdom."
The same failed prophecy can be found in:
Mark 9:1 And he said to them, "I tell you the truth, some who are standing here will not taste death before they see the kingdom of God come with power."
Luke 9:27 I tell you the truth, some who are standing here will not taste death before they see the kingdom of God.
The answer you are going to give is totally predictable and has nothing at all to do with what the texts says, hows that for prophecy?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by drummachine, posted 04-12-2003 7:21 PM drummachine has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 6 by drummachine, posted 04-12-2003 8:40 PM Brian has replied

  
drummachine
Inactive Member


Message 4 of 19 (36858)
04-12-2003 8:26 PM
Reply to: Message 2 by Coragyps
04-12-2003 7:49 PM


Coragyps,
Christianity is not a sect. It is the promise to all. And the Gospel of Jesus Christ is for all mankind. Whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved. The Bible clearly is set apart from all books for those who are willing to find the creator. And according to the Bible we are living in the end times. But when it was written almost 2,000 years they were in the end times. If interested I will show you from scripture that we are living in the end times.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2 by Coragyps, posted 04-12-2003 7:49 PM Coragyps has replied

Replies to this message:
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 Message 7 by Coragyps, posted 04-12-2003 8:46 PM drummachine has not replied
 Message 8 by Coragyps, posted 04-12-2003 8:52 PM drummachine has replied

  
Brian
Member (Idle past 4959 days)
Posts: 4659
From: Scotland
Joined: 10-22-2002


Message 5 of 19 (36859)
04-12-2003 8:31 PM
Reply to: Message 4 by drummachine
04-12-2003 8:26 PM


Hey Drummachine
Christianity is a sect arising from Judaism, please educate yourself.
[This message has been edited by Brian Johnston, 04-12-2003]

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drummachine
Inactive Member


Message 6 of 19 (36860)
04-12-2003 8:40 PM
Reply to: Message 3 by Brian
04-12-2003 7:56 PM


Brian,
Would you please be willing to show me evidence of Hinduism not believing everything is God? I believe there are three teachings of Hinduism.
Paul and David both were both not the Messiah. Jesus Christ who was God in flesh yet emptied himself and became a servant didn't come in glory and majesty. And he came to give his life for the sins of the world. Did Paul or David?
In the four Gospels Christ when he teaches is talking about two kingdoms. The passages you mentioned were talking about the mount of transfiguration. He met with Moses and Elijah in his glorified state. James, Peter and John were there. Peter said, "Lord it is good we are hear. We should make three tabernacles." They saw Christ in his glorified state. Thats all that is.
1)One kingdom is the work of God on earth
2)The other is the literal kingdom in heaven.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3 by Brian, posted 04-12-2003 7:56 PM Brian has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 10 by Brian, posted 04-12-2003 9:03 PM drummachine has replied

  
Coragyps
Member (Idle past 734 days)
Posts: 5553
From: Snyder, Texas, USA
Joined: 11-12-2002


Message 7 of 19 (36862)
04-12-2003 8:46 PM
Reply to: Message 4 by drummachine
04-12-2003 8:26 PM


Christianity is not a sect.
You may be right - it's about 2000 different sects, each of which makes a greater or lesser claim to be the only true version.
Is 2000 guessing way too low?

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Coragyps
Member (Idle past 734 days)
Posts: 5553
From: Snyder, Texas, USA
Joined: 11-12-2002


Message 8 of 19 (36863)
04-12-2003 8:52 PM
Reply to: Message 4 by drummachine
04-12-2003 8:26 PM


If interested I will show you from scripture that we are living in the end times.
I'm not interested, thanks. It's been done, as I said above, at least a couple of times a decade for the last few centuries. Now if you can show me that we are living in the end times from something E.G.E. Bulwer-Lytton wrote, it at least would be something novel.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4 by drummachine, posted 04-12-2003 8:26 PM drummachine has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 9 by drummachine, posted 04-12-2003 8:58 PM Coragyps has replied
 Message 14 by Mister Pamboli, posted 04-12-2003 10:03 PM Coragyps has replied

  
drummachine
Inactive Member


Message 9 of 19 (36865)
04-12-2003 8:58 PM
Reply to: Message 8 by Coragyps
04-12-2003 8:52 PM


Coragyps,
1)What are those 2,000 different sects?
2)Who is E.G.E. Bulwer-Lytton?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 8 by Coragyps, posted 04-12-2003 8:52 PM Coragyps has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 12 by Coragyps, posted 04-12-2003 9:51 PM drummachine has replied

  
Brian
Member (Idle past 4959 days)
Posts: 4659
From: Scotland
Joined: 10-22-2002


Message 10 of 19 (36866)
04-12-2003 9:03 PM
Reply to: Message 6 by drummachine
04-12-2003 8:40 PM


Sure,
A common misunderstanding of Hinduism emerges from the many Hindu names for God. But instead of actually signifying different "Gods," the names merely signify different aspects of God. Hinduism is monotheistic, just as Christianity and all other religions are.
From here: http://www.bellaonline.com/articles/art7701.asp
Hinduism only has one God, who is called Brahman, all other 'gods' are only aspects of the one true god, a bit like the trinity myth.
Paul and David both were both not the Messiah. Jesus Christ who was God in flesh yet emptied himself and became a servant didn't come in glory and majesty. And he came to give his life for the sins of the world. Did Paul or David?
I didn't say Paul was the messiah, I said he was more influential than Jesus. I would say that David is more like the 'warrior-preist' that the messiah is supposed to be. The messiah was to free Israel, if anything Israel was even more persecuted after Jesus died.
The passages you mentioned were talking about the mount of transfiguration. He met with Moses and Elijah in his glorified state. James, Peter and John were there. Peter said, "Lord it is good we are hear. We should make three tabernacles." They saw Christ in his glorified state. Thats all that is.
Could you elaborate on this as I think you are grossly mistaken about the context of these quotes?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 6 by drummachine, posted 04-12-2003 8:40 PM drummachine has replied

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drummachine
Inactive Member


Message 11 of 19 (36869)
04-12-2003 9:40 PM
Reply to: Message 10 by Brian
04-12-2003 9:03 PM


Brian,
I believe there are over 330 million gods in Asia. Hinduism for example. Have they crafted idols by their own hands and do they worhship them?
Paul has not been more influential than Jesus Christ because God worked through Paul. The epistels were penned by Paul but inspired by God. The foundation of Christianity is Jesus Christ.
Israel was expecting the Messiah to come as King. But they didn't understand the prophecies that the Messiah would first come and give his life. The purpose of the first coming was to free man from sin. The eternal reign of the Messiah is a future prophecy to be fulfilled. Israel has been percecuted because of the wickedness of man.
The transfiguration was a revelation of the glory of the Son of God, a glory hidden now but to be fully revealed when he returns. The "kingdom of God" is a difficult teaching but thats what it means in that context. For example,
Matthew 13:33 He told them another parable: "The kingdom of heaven is like yeast that a woman took and mixed into three measures of flour until it spread through all of it."
Jesus Christ has come into the world to give life to all.

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Coragyps
Member (Idle past 734 days)
Posts: 5553
From: Snyder, Texas, USA
Joined: 11-12-2002


Message 12 of 19 (36870)
04-12-2003 9:51 PM
Reply to: Message 9 by drummachine
04-12-2003 8:58 PM


2000 sects -- I likely will get tired of typing and forget a few, but ya got your:
Church of God Anderson Indiana
Church of God Cleveland Tennessee
Church of God Charleston Tennessee
Church of God in Christ
Church og God, The
Church of God of Prophecy
Living Church of God
United Church of God
Worldwide Church of God
Active Bible CoG
Pentecostal CoG
The Philadelphia CoG
CoG (Seventh Day)
You get the idea - that's the first two pages that Googled up. Pages 3 to 5 have another eight or so, and you can see I didn't even start on Baptists.
Bulwer-Lytton will Google, too. He's a now-dead author.

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drummachine
Inactive Member


Message 13 of 19 (36873)
04-12-2003 9:59 PM
Reply to: Message 12 by Coragyps
04-12-2003 9:51 PM


Coragyps,
Yes, but the reason there all these types of demnominations is because of differences in interpreting the text of the Bible. For one believes Jesus can only be the Son of God and one believes He is God even though he is the Son of God. Why would it matter if something was written by Bulwer-Lytton?

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Mister Pamboli
Member (Idle past 7576 days)
Posts: 634
From: Washington, USA
Joined: 12-10-2001


Message 14 of 19 (36874)
04-12-2003 10:03 PM
Reply to: Message 8 by Coragyps
04-12-2003 8:52 PM


Bulmer-Lytton as prophet of the end times
This is perhaps Bulmer-Lyyton's most famous passage:
"It was a dark and stormy night and the rain fell in torrents -- except at occasional intervals, when it was checked by a violent gust of wind which swept up the streets (for it is in London that our scene lies), rattling along the housetops, and fiercely agitating the scanty flame of the lamps that struggled against the darkness."
I think it is quite clear that Bulmer-Lytton is referring to the the last war against Iraq - which was of course known as Desert Storm. Torrents, in the orginal, is simply another way of saying "rivers", a natural image for the two great rivers of the Mesopotamia, "the land between the rivers", now known as Iraq.
The rain, of course, refers to "Steel Rain" - the Iraqi name for the multi-launch missile batteries used by the US during that war http://www.ngb.army.mil/gallery/heritage/steelrain.shtml
Clearly, as Desert Storm referred to the US action, the US missle batteries, the "steel rain" had to checked for practical reasons while the wind, the "storm" rushed forward to control the streets and "roads" of the towns and highways at is moved forwards.
Many have been puzzled by the reference to London in this difficult passage, but they have not read it with a heart open to Bulmer-Lytton's true purpose. "London", of course, can mean in common speech the British Government, as you might say, "London approved the invasion." Many have been led astray by trying to read this passage metaphorically rather than finding the true meaning, which is quite straightforward. Does not Bulmer-Lytton make it clear for us - "it is in London that our scene lies. You see? It is in London that we view these events, but that does not mean that they occured in London. It is a measure of the poetry of this passage that "our scene" alliterates so perfectly with "our CNN." Now we can see the true message of the passage ...
Desert Storm is raining steel on the populated areas of Mesopotamia (Iraq), while we watch it (it is our scene) from London - remember that Bulmer-Lytton was English so it is natural for him to locate the viewer there.)
What of "agitating the scanty flame of the lamps that struggled against the darkness" - is this not obscure? There can be little doubt that this refers to Israel, the "light unto the gentiles." How fierce it's struggles, how scanty its resources in comparison to its enemies! And how agitated its people at that time of trouble, as missiles reached its cities!
Seen in this light, it is clear that Bulmer-Lytton's great work starts and proceeds as a summary of the great world events that lead to our inevitable end.
If more proof were needed, and only the most hardened skeptic would need more, turn to page 147 and this passage ...
"As the trees rapidly disappeared behind them, the riders entered, at a hand gallop, on a broad tract of waste land ... So briskly leaped the heart of the leader of the three,"
You see now - to what else could "three horsemen" refer?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 8 by Coragyps, posted 04-12-2003 8:52 PM Coragyps has replied

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Coragyps
Member (Idle past 734 days)
Posts: 5553
From: Snyder, Texas, USA
Joined: 11-12-2002


Message 15 of 19 (36877)
04-12-2003 10:53 PM
Reply to: Message 14 by Mister Pamboli
04-12-2003 10:03 PM


Re: Bulmer-Lytton as prophet of the end times
Mr Pamboli, sir, I stand in awe, groveling at your feet.
Drum, what difference does it make that three or four anonymous authors wrote letters in the guise of some guy named Saul or Paul, and then that 200 years later a group of church beaurocrats decided that those particular ones needed to be saved for posterity? Yes, it's a little bit deeper subject matter in parts that B-L's novelizing, but Mr Pamboli has just showed the world what real, kick-butt prophecy looks like. None of that vague "ten horns on seven heads" stuff there.....

This message is a reply to:
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