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Author Topic:   Belief Statement - jar
New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member

Message 83 of 300 (324270)
06-21-2006 9:06 AM
Reply to: Message 79 by Brian
06-21-2006 5:26 AM

Invalid christian teaching?
But Jar is specifically saying that people who deny that Jesus is the incarnation of God will still be saved. This is different from someone who just goes about doing good deeds.

They aren't neccessarily different.

Is it a case of ignoring the bits of the Bible that contradict a particular position?

Its about looking at the New Testament as a whole and not trying to pick out bits that might seem different than the whole.

I want you to see another christian's opinion on salvation, namely mine, that not believing that Jesus is god does not forfeit your ticket to heaven. You dan't have to believe that Jesus was god to accept salvation.

Now, I'm sure you could pick some lines from the Bible that suggest otherwise, as I could pick some that suggest just this, but certainly, agreeing with this does not mean that you are not a christian. Believing that you have to believe that Jesus is god to get to heaven is not a requirement of christianity.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 79 by Brian, posted 06-21-2006 5:26 AM Brian has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 158 by Brian, posted 06-27-2006 7:56 AM New Cat's Eye has not yet responded

New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member

Message 84 of 300 (324276)
06-21-2006 9:14 AM
Reply to: Message 81 by Brian
06-21-2006 5:55 AM

Re: Valid christian teaching?
Essentially, it claims that anyone can’ say’ they are a Xian, but it is more than a declaration of faith, it is putting Jesus’ teachings into practice.

What about someone who puts Jesus' teaching into practice but does not 'say' they are christian?

I'd say they can go to heaven. You think that Jesus' teaches that they can't?

You can ignore the vast majority of Jesus teachings if you wish, but you can’t call it xianity.

Just like you can refrain from calling it christianity while following the vast majority of Jesus' teachings if you wish. I don't think you have to be calling yourself a christian or even actually believe Jesus was god. Its about following what the teachings are (the will of father), not what name you give god.

If a muslim calls god by the wrong name but lives a life that follow what the teachings of Jesus are, don't you think they can go to heaven? You think that Jesus teaches that they can't?

Why not just save people instead of going through the pointless sacrifice?

Thats a thread all in its own.

Oh, I couldn’t agree more, it is easy to say you are a Christian, but actually being one is a different matter.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 81 by Brian, posted 06-21-2006 5:55 AM Brian has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 92 by jar, posted 06-21-2006 10:47 AM New Cat's Eye has responded
 Message 160 by Brian, posted 06-27-2006 1:28 PM New Cat's Eye has not yet responded

New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member

Message 85 of 300 (324280)
06-21-2006 9:21 AM
Reply to: Message 82 by Brian
06-21-2006 7:47 AM

do onto others
When you try to treat others as you would like to be treated, everybody wins.

I hope observe this when that S&M guy who lives near you comes calling. ;)

There's a way around this one...

If Jar doesn't want to be in bondage (although I assume he does) then the S&M guy would be doing something to Jar that Jar didn't want done to him. Now, presumably, this guy wouldn't want someone to do something to him that he didn't want done to him, so if he follows the golden rule, he will not tie up Jar.

The problem is with people who would have someone do something to them that they don't want done to them. The thing is, though, do they really not want those things done to them?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 82 by Brian, posted 06-21-2006 7:47 AM Brian has not yet responded

New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member

Message 91 of 300 (324329)
06-21-2006 10:44 AM
Reply to: Message 90 by GDR
06-21-2006 10:35 AM

CS Lewis in "The Last Battle" writes:

Therefore if any man swear by Tash and keep his oath for the oath’s sake, it is by me that he has truly sworn, though he know it not, and it is I who reward him. And if any man do a cruelty in my name, then, though he says he says the name Aslan, it is Tash whom he serves and by Tash his deed is accepted.

That's a great one. I've never read that before, thanks for posting it.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 90 by GDR, posted 06-21-2006 10:35 AM GDR has not yet responded

New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member

Message 96 of 300 (324363)
06-21-2006 11:24 AM
Reply to: Message 92 by jar
06-21-2006 10:47 AM

Re: On what the Great Sacrifice was.
Jesus very life and presence is the Great Sacrifice and it was to bring us the message that we all do start off saved. We do not start off sinners, we do not start off damned, we do not suffer from original sin, we are not Fallen, we are loved.

For us and for our salvation He came down from heaven.

If we start off saved, then what are we being salvaged from? The sins we choose aftarwards? Why would we need salvation if we are already saved?

Love GOD...

When asked those questions he could have easily said "Worship Me", but He doesn't. There is nothing in those two related to professing faith, to worship, even related to belief, instead it is a call and command to action.

Some might take the call to love as a request for worship, but when asked 'how' we love god, Jesus gave a fine explanation in Matt25, agree?

Its about what you do in how you treat others, yeah?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 92 by jar, posted 06-21-2006 10:47 AM jar has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 98 by jar, posted 06-21-2006 11:46 AM New Cat's Eye has not yet responded

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