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Author Topic:   Biogenesis
Taz
Member (Idle past 1917 days)
Posts: 5069
From: Zerus
Joined: 07-18-2006


Message 11 of 312 (473029)
06-26-2008 3:24 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by AlphaOmegakid
06-25-2008 8:17 AM


AlphaOmegakid writes:

Why is the law of biogenesis which states that "all life comes from preexisting living matter" not taught in any modern textbook today?


First of all, it's not actually a law, although it's sometimes refered to as a law. But more importantly, IT IS BEING TAUGHT IN SCHOOL, unless of course you don't pay attention in class.

It is probably one of the most widely used laws in biology and biological studies, but the law and the history of the law is ignored.

Yeah, and oxygen gas is probably the most widely used compound in the history of man, and yet you won't find it mentioned once in any history book. Why? Because it's a duh kinda thing, unless you're a special kind of idiot.

I'm a firm believer in teaching science in schools, and not teaching non-science matters which are religious. How can we justify teaching abiogenetic science which is full of faith and little evidence and not teach biogenesis which is full of science and no faith?

I don't know what you are smoking, but when I was in high school a kazillion years ago when certain hypotheses of abiogenesis were introduced our teacher kept repeating that they were all educated guesses, nothing more.

Abiogenesis is not "full of faith". We know for a fact that organic compounds form naturally under certain conditions. Scientists have been able to observe pre-cells form naturally under certain conditions. While abiogenesis is still in its infancy, it is definitely not based on faith.

Go ahead and try this some time. Go to any college or university and talk to any biology professor about abiogensis. You're going to get a lot of I-don't-knows and it's-hard-to-says because that's the truth. Unlike religionists who are know-it-alls, people in academia are at least more honest about what they do and don't know.


I'm trying to see things your way, but I can't put my head that far up my ass.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by AlphaOmegakid, posted 06-25-2008 8:17 AM AlphaOmegakid has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 13 by AlphaOmegakid, posted 06-26-2008 4:00 PM Taz has responded

Taz
Member (Idle past 1917 days)
Posts: 5069
From: Zerus
Joined: 07-18-2006


Message 31 of 312 (473089)
06-26-2008 11:24 PM
Reply to: Message 13 by AlphaOmegakid
06-26-2008 4:00 PM


AlphaOmegakid writes:

I will be glad to discuss any subject intellectually with anyone. But from my scientific observations, that is hard to do with someone who is full of logical fallacies (ad hominen attacks). The evidence demonstrates that your thinking is fallacious and illogical.

This is not intended to be an ad hominen attack against you, it is the reality of your argument. I hope I can discuss scientific matters in an intellectual way with respect and dignity.


A word of advice. Using more than 2 big words in a sentence gives away the fact that you're trying really hard to impress people. But what really gives you away is your wrongful accusation of an ad hominem. Some people, like myself, have grown quite clever at wording our arguments to make them look fallacious to the typical newbie. In fact, it's second nature for me and I don't even think about it anymore.

That said, perhaps you'd like to counter my argument rather than just throwing out big words?

Added by edit.

By the way, you do realize that what you did was quote-mining, yes?

Edited by Taz, : No reason given.

Edited by Taz, : No reason given.


I'm trying to see things your way, but I can't put my head that far up my ass.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 13 by AlphaOmegakid, posted 06-26-2008 4:00 PM AlphaOmegakid has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 36 by AlphaOmegakid, posted 06-27-2008 9:55 AM Taz has responded

Taz
Member (Idle past 1917 days)
Posts: 5069
From: Zerus
Joined: 07-18-2006


Message 32 of 312 (473092)
06-26-2008 11:35 PM
Reply to: Message 30 by AlphaOmegakid
06-26-2008 11:21 PM


Re: I didn't say.....the strawman
AlphaOmegakid writes:

The law of biogenesis is virtually non existent in modern scientific literature and textbooks. However, modern textbooks have chapters on the origin of life and abiogenesis. With biogenesis we have overwhelming evidence and plenty of application for the good of humanity. With abiogenesis we have zero evidence and no application for the good of humanity. So why the disparity in what is being taught?


As has been pointed out to you many times, the so-called "law of biogenesis" isn't usually referred to as "law of biogensis". Instead, the concept is taught pretty much from 5th grade in just about every curriculum in the country. Again, have you been paying attention in your biology classes? Heck, I even remember learning about Pasteur and the scientific discipline that resulted from his experiments in history class.

Since many are arguing that the law of biogenesis does not make abiogenesis impossible, let me clearly state that first that this is a straw man argument. It certainly isn't mine.

Just so you know, it's not strawman in this particular case. It's just simple misunderstanding.

You really ought to familiarize yourself more with the fallacies before you use them on the battlefield... I mean during debate.


I'm trying to see things your way, but I can't put my head that far up my ass.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 30 by AlphaOmegakid, posted 06-26-2008 11:21 PM AlphaOmegakid has not yet responded

Taz
Member (Idle past 1917 days)
Posts: 5069
From: Zerus
Joined: 07-18-2006


Message 43 of 312 (473154)
06-27-2008 12:01 PM
Reply to: Message 36 by AlphaOmegakid
06-27-2008 9:55 AM


Re: Stop before you do too much damage
AlphaOmegakid writes:

I cited the whole article. I quoted in context. And I did not mislead with Huxley's comments.


Huh? I was talking about you quote-mining me. You specifically left out all the contents with meat and only quoted the side comments to give the impression that the side comments were the entirety of my argument.

I have some shovels for you though. Your hole is getting deeper.

Haha, ok.


I'm trying to see things your way, but I can't put my head that far up my ass.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 36 by AlphaOmegakid, posted 06-27-2008 9:55 AM AlphaOmegakid has not yet responded

Taz
Member (Idle past 1917 days)
Posts: 5069
From: Zerus
Joined: 07-18-2006


Message 45 of 312 (473157)
06-27-2008 12:05 PM
Reply to: Message 37 by AlphaOmegakid
06-27-2008 10:07 AM


Re: I didn't say.....the strawman
AOK writes:

I think most real doctors would fall out of their chairs laughing at such a statement.

Well, most real doctors used to fall out of their chairs laughing when they were told to wash their hands before doing anything with their patients. This was, of course, before the germ theory of disease.

Doctors make lousy scientists.


I'm trying to see things your way, but I can't put my head that far up my ass.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 37 by AlphaOmegakid, posted 06-27-2008 10:07 AM AlphaOmegakid has not yet responded

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