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Author Topic:   Question about evolution, genetic bottlenecks, and inbreeding
Rahvin
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Posts: 4039
Joined: 07-01-2005
Member Rating: 8.2


Message 5 of 123 (503058)
03-15-2009 7:20 PM
Reply to: Message 4 by harry
03-15-2009 7:04 PM


Re: A Unwell Researched Opinion
Ok, so I kinda knew that.
So, I am struggling to wrap my head fully around common ancestor and how that ties in with inbreeding.
So one little monkey, has fun time with another monkey, and they have 2 baby monkies, monkey one goes on to become humans, the other goes onto become chimpanzees.
So monkey 1 is our concestor with chimps. however, even if monkey 1, were to mate with 5 females, the grandchildren would all be very inbred.
Can somebody draw me a tree of how 1 ancestor gets enough genetic material to mix it up? Because surely it can't get that many from the species it split with, or it would not be the common ancestor, and the whole process would start again.
You're confused because that's not the way evolution works. You're close, but "common ancestor" does not imply individual.
Evolution occurs over populations.
So, Population A is comprised of 20,000 individuals. Something happens, and that population splits into two daughter populations - Pop. B and C, each with around 10,000 individuals. These two populations, if they do not interbreed, will continue to evolve in divergent pathways. Population B could be the ancestors of humanity, while Population C could be the ancestors of chimpanzees.
No inbreeding required.
The separation of populations can happen for any number of reasons - natural disasters, migration due to overpopulation, what have you.
Edited by Rahvin, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4 by harry, posted 03-15-2009 7:04 PM harry has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 6 by harry, posted 03-15-2009 7:26 PM Rahvin has replied

  
Rahvin
Member
Posts: 4039
Joined: 07-01-2005
Member Rating: 8.2


Message 8 of 123 (503062)
03-15-2009 7:53 PM
Reply to: Message 6 by harry
03-15-2009 7:26 PM


Re: A Unwell Researched Opinion
I got the impression from the text books that a common ancestor was an individual.
That's a mistaken impression. As I said, evolution happens over populations, not individuals. It's an incredibly slow process that happens by increments of mutations - Species X does not give birth to Species Y. Species Y is a descendant of Species X only after many generations of mutations sufficient to disallow interbreeding between the two.
In each generation, the given population is able to interbreed with itself. No familial inbreeding, and no "single individual" common ancestors (Not to say that single individual common ancestors are impossible, simply that this is not typically what happens).

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 Message 6 by harry, posted 03-15-2009 7:26 PM harry has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 9 by harry, posted 03-15-2009 8:02 PM Rahvin has replied

  
Rahvin
Member
Posts: 4039
Joined: 07-01-2005
Member Rating: 8.2


Message 10 of 123 (503064)
03-15-2009 8:05 PM
Reply to: Message 9 by harry
03-15-2009 8:02 PM


Re: A Unwell Researched Opinion
So there is a difference between most recent common ancestor, which is an individual, and a common ancestor?
Incorrect. The most recent common ancestor is still the most recent common ancestor species, which is a population. Individuals don't even enter the picture. All of Species Y is not descended from an individual of Species X; Species Y is descended from a population from Species X.

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 Message 9 by harry, posted 03-15-2009 8:02 PM harry has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 11 by harry, posted 03-15-2009 8:09 PM Rahvin has not replied
 Message 13 by lyx2no, posted 03-15-2009 8:27 PM Rahvin has not replied

  
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