Understanding through Discussion


Welcome! You are not logged in. [ Login ]
EvC Forum active members: 63 (9072 total)
80 online now:
mike the wiz, PaulK, Stile, Tangle (4 members, 76 visitors)
Newest Member: FossilDiscovery
Post Volume: Total: 893,196 Year: 4,308/6,534 Month: 522/900 Week: 46/182 Day: 18/16 Hour: 2/4


Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
Author Topic:   "Best" evidence for evolution.
JonF
Member
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 174 of 830 (856857)
07-03-2019 1:24 PM
Reply to: Message 171 by Sarah Bellum
07-03-2019 11:51 AM


Can't disprove it, it's true.

But Faith doesn't know where her towel is.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 171 by Sarah Bellum, posted 07-03-2019 11:51 AM Sarah Bellum has seen this message

  
JonF
Member
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 253 of 830 (869648)
01-03-2020 10:25 AM
Reply to: Message 252 by Faith
01-03-2020 10:15 AM


Re: Message 107, topic 7: other stuff
Is the extra heart chamber functional?

Irrelevant.

How many more changes would be needed to make it functional

Nobody knows. What would be the interest in knowing whether it's 91 or 1,857 or 893 or ...

What's to guarantee they'd occur where they need to occur?

Nothing. The possibilities that could happen are many orders of magnitude larger than what does happen.

You just can't understand the evolution has no goal.

Edited by JonF, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 252 by Faith, posted 01-03-2020 10:15 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 254 by Faith, posted 01-03-2020 10:47 AM JonF has replied

  
JonF
Member
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 255 of 830 (869659)
01-03-2020 11:17 AM
Reply to: Message 254 by Faith
01-03-2020 10:47 AM


Re: Message 107, topic 7: other stuff
the number of trials even to get a small functioning part would be impossible

Not when selection is operating.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 254 by Faith, posted 01-03-2020 10:47 AM Faith has taken no action

Replies to this message:
 Message 256 by jar, posted 01-03-2020 11:26 AM JonF has taken no action

  
JonF
Member
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 258 of 830 (869664)
01-03-2020 11:44 AM
Reply to: Message 257 by Faith
01-03-2020 11:30 AM


Re: And one more thing
As long as you speak in abstract generalizaions without evidence your opinion is meaningless.

Show your calculations of why it won't work.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 257 by Faith, posted 01-03-2020 11:30 AM Faith has taken no action

  
JonF
Member
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 263 of 830 (869679)
01-03-2020 5:32 PM
Reply to: Message 262 by Faith
01-03-2020 5:05 PM


Re: Message 107, topic 7: other stuff
You all think microevolution just keeps going but that is impossible. That is why I'm saying all you've got to get from species to species is trial and error. It's the only possibility. You can call it crap all you want. Obviously that makes yhou feel better but it doesn't change the fact that you can't get from one species to another any other way, and there's no way to predict that you're going to get any kind of useful mutations.. The genetic stuff is not built into the genome, that's only for the variations within the species. I'll come back to this again, can't get through it all now

As long as you speak in abstract generalizations your fantasies are meaningless.

Selection can't do anything, you have to have the stuff to select and that's where all you've got is trial and error.

Selection selects, that has an effect. Trial and error plus selection is staggeringly powerful.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 262 by Faith, posted 01-03-2020 5:05 PM Faith has taken no action

  
JonF
Member
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 281 of 830 (869964)
01-09-2020 5:46 PM
Reply to: Message 278 by Faith
01-09-2020 5:30 PM


Re: Message 107, topic 7: other stuff
Well, you make up a lot of what you write.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 278 by Faith, posted 01-09-2020 5:30 PM Faith has taken no action

  
JonF
Member
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 383 of 830 (870415)
01-19-2020 9:50 AM
Reply to: Message 379 by Faith
01-19-2020 2:54 AM


Re: Homo habilis feet
Selection.

But you have to hold on to your ignorance.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 379 by Faith, posted 01-19-2020 2:54 AM Faith has taken no action

  
JonF
Member
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


(1)
Message 409 of 830 (870578)
01-22-2020 12:41 PM
Reply to: Message 407 by Faith
01-22-2020 11:09 AM


Re: My 2 sense worth
Conferring a benefit is not required. Not being too harmful is required.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 407 by Faith, posted 01-22-2020 11:09 AM Faith has taken no action

Replies to this message:
 Message 410 by jar, posted 01-22-2020 12:53 PM JonF has taken no action
 Message 415 by dwise1, posted 01-22-2020 2:11 PM JonF has replied

  
JonF
Member
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 418 of 830 (870608)
01-22-2020 3:59 PM
Reply to: Message 412 by Faith
01-22-2020 1:33 PM


Re: what is "something brand new" if a new specie isn't enough?
You left out brand new genes in some offspring.

Caused by _________

(You fill in the blank)


This message is a reply to:
 Message 412 by Faith, posted 01-22-2020 1:33 PM Faith has taken no action

  
JonF
Member
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 419 of 830 (870609)
01-22-2020 3:59 PM
Reply to: Message 412 by Faith
01-22-2020 1:33 PM


Re: what is "something brand new" if a new specie isn't enough?
{Double}

Edited by JonF, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 412 by Faith, posted 01-22-2020 1:33 PM Faith has taken no action

  
JonF
Member
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 420 of 830 (870611)
01-22-2020 4:03 PM
Reply to: Message 415 by dwise1
01-22-2020 2:11 PM


Re: My 2 sense worth
And if a mutation results in a tiny phenotypical change with no effect on fitness, it can spread through the population..

This message is a reply to:
 Message 415 by dwise1, posted 01-22-2020 2:11 PM dwise1 has taken no action

Replies to this message:
 Message 421 by Faith, posted 01-22-2020 4:45 PM JonF has replied

  
JonF
Member
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


(1)
Message 422 of 830 (870618)
01-22-2020 4:52 PM
Reply to: Message 421 by Faith
01-22-2020 4:45 PM


Re: My 2 sense worth
Yep.

Then the cumulative effect of those tny changes is significance phenotypic change and maybe increased fitness.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 421 by Faith, posted 01-22-2020 4:45 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 423 by Faith, posted 01-22-2020 6:40 PM JonF has replied

  
JonF
Member
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 429 of 830 (870640)
01-23-2020 9:34 AM
Reply to: Message 423 by Faith
01-22-2020 6:40 PM


Re: My 2 sense worth
Brown eyes aren't a good example. The mammalian ear would be.

One mutation produces a minor neutral phenotypic variation that spreads via neutral drift.

Another mutation produces a further minor neutral phenotypic variation that spreads via neutral drift.

Another mutation produces a further minor neutral phenotypic variation of the same part(s) that spreads via neutral drift.

Another mutation produces a further minor neutral phenotypic variation of the same part(s) that spreads via neutral drift.

Another mutation produces a further minor neutral phenotypic variation of the same part(s) that spreads via neutral drift.

Wow, now the cumulative phenotypic variation is significant! and may affect fitness.

Trillions upon trillions upon gazillions of trials. Millions of years.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 423 by Faith, posted 01-22-2020 6:40 PM Faith has taken no action

  
JonF
Member
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


(1)
Message 530 of 830 (870949)
01-26-2020 5:49 PM
Reply to: Message 527 by Faith
01-26-2020 5:28 PM


Re: Back to the WEASEL program
I'm amazed at what snowflakes so many right-wingers are.

Make sure you clutch your pearls and collapse gracefully on your fainting couch.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 527 by Faith, posted 01-26-2020 5:28 PM Faith has taken no action

  
JonF
Member
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 582 of 830 (873629)
03-17-2020 7:21 PM
Reply to: Message 580 by Faith
03-17-2020 6:27 PM


Re: Ordinary selection of built in variation is not species to species evolution
it would always be mutating into something else

Not a problem, as long as the rate of change isn't enough to interfere with reproduction.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 580 by Faith, posted 03-17-2020 6:27 PM Faith has taken no action

Replies to this message:
 Message 583 by jar, posted 03-17-2020 7:34 PM JonF has taken no action

  
Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2018 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.1
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2022