Define "Kind"

Not really. A hypothesis is a scientific term used to pose a researched, well thought out, potential answer to a stated question or problem. You must design experiments to test your idea, and see if the data support or reject the hypothesis. Creationists have done none of this. I disagree. While I guess it is true that you can work from a hypothesis...the work being done is called 'experimentation" and is designed such that the validity of your hypothesis can be determined. You can't just say "we have a hypothesis" and then go on as if you have conducted copious tests and arrived at some conclusion.Just out of curiosity...what is this supposed hypothesis? You say "you" have one, so let’s see it.

You know, I try to give people the benefit of the doubt. I try to take in all accounts and/or explanations for explaining life on this planet...but this goes beyond anything I can accept. The unbelievable juggling of facts and the amount of mental gymnastics you have to play in order to arrive at such a patently ridiculous claim stuns me. To be completely honest, I don’t believe you Faith. Why? Well , even when provided with facts, you ignore them and call them rough analogies. To me . that’s mental (if not intentional) dishonesty. But hey, it’s a free Country and you can believe what ever you want. Please, though, just don’t ask me to accept that such methods should be allowed in the teaching of science to our children. What do you know of vertebrate anatomy, genetics, cladistics and animal behavior that allows you seriously claim something like this? Admit it, this is just mere uniformed speculation on your part and means nothing at all. Again, that’s fine with me . it’s your life and if you choose to remain blind to science, so be it. I just don’t see how you can get through a typical day arbitrarily picking and choosing what you will accept as fact and what you will reject.I'm not trying to be combative or insulting, but it's not easy Faith. You willfully ignore any evidence that contradicts your preconceived notions about life on this planet. Sorry, but while I know you don't really care about my opinion, I find that sort of attitude almost childish in nature. Opinions are one thing, but to attest that you are right and "we" are wrong because the Bible says so is simply ignorant.For example, you yourself have claimed to be struggling with a lot of genetic information provided to you at this site by numerous posters. Normally, that would be a good thing. The problem in your case, as I see it, is that unlike a "student" who is trying to learn about genetics...you have no plan on learning anything. All you want to do is take what has been taught to you and twist it around or ignore it completely in a feeble attempt to justify in your mind that all this genetic information you have acquired and learned about is, in fact, incorrect (if it goes against your beliefs). Does that not trouble you spiritually? Are you not at all bothered by the fact that you have to take information provided to you by experts in the field and then play mind games with yourself to try to come up with an explanation of why it is wrong?But this is a thread to see if we can get a definition of "kind", and it appears that none is forth coming. We get the "we're working on it", and the "it's a working hypothesis", and the "I'm sure we'll get one some time in the future", and the "it really doesn't matter" sort of stuff...but we never actually get a definition.Anyway, sorry if I insulted you, it was not my intent. I just got back from getting a root canal done and I'm a but drugged up and grumpy.

This whole thing kind of reminds me of a joke I once heard. I won’t name names, but nonetheless, this joke reminds me of someone here.There was this nice little old lady down in New Orleans. She had the utmost belief in the bible and a deep faith in God. Well, it seems that a hurricane was predicted to hit New Orleans and the local weather station advised people to evacuate. The little old lady . let’s call her Wilma . said: “No, I think I’ll stay, I have faith in God and he will protect me”. The storm hits and water levels began to rise. A nice police officer knocked on Wilma’s door and informed her that the flood waters would continue to rise and that she should evacuate. “No”, she said, “I have faith in God and he will protect me”. Soon the water was lapping at her front door. A neighbor, in a nice pair of neoprene waders knocked on her door. She answered and he told her that the water was getting pretty deep and that maybe she should leave. “No” she told him, God will protect me, I have faith in that”. A while later a boat pulled up to her second story window. A lady in Coast Guard boat rapped on the window and when Wilma opened it up, she told her to hop in the boat so she could be taken to safety. “No thank you”, Wilma told her, “I have faith in God and he’ll protect me”. Eventually she was sitting on her roof when from out of the heavens a wonderful sight appeared. It was, of course . a helicopter . from which a man was lowered in an attempt to rescue poor old Wilma from her roof before it was too late. As the man tried to help her slip on the vest and collar so she could be hoisted to safety, she politely told him “Thanks, but no, God will surely save me, I have faith”.Well, she died. She drowned when the flood waters washed her from the roof and carried her off. She indeed was a lady of deep faith and upon arrival at the pearly gates she was immediately welcomed. She was granted a meeting with God himself and after a bit of small talk she said to God: “God, may I ask you a question?” God, told her "Sure, ask me anything you wish”. “Well”, she asks, “As you well know, I am a women of deep faith and I tried to do your bidding throughout my life . why did you not save me but instead allow me to drown?” God sets back and says “What more could I do Wilma . I had a weather man tell you to evacuate, I sent you a police officer, I sent you your neighbor, I sent you the Coast Guard, and I sent you a helicopter?”Anyway . a terrible telling of the joke, but it does seem to make a valid point. For some, nothing will shake their belief.

Yes, I understand that Faith and the joke was just that...a joke. The appropriateness of it, however, was meant to be more along the lines of refusing to accept factual information because it conflicts with a 2000 year old book. It seems that absolutely no evidence, no matter how well supported it may be, will make you question the validity of the Bible. While I think your rock solid faith is admirable, I also find it somewhat sad. You gladly accept science (you are after all using a computer and I assume you live in a house, drive a car, and utilize modern medicine) on a daily basis but I have a feeling that even if God himself came down from the heavens and told you to stop literally interpreting the Bible, you would not be able to do so. God has provided us with copious amounts of data that do nothing but support the theory of evolution, and we, in turn have provided it to you. Yet you just brush it all aside and cover your ears and eyes, and instead blissfully accept as factual information, an interpretation (written by men) of some stories from long ago.Even when, by your own admission, the Bible cannot (or does not) supply you with answers (what is a ”kind”), you refuse to question its authority. Instead, you ignore science (when convienent) and make a broad claim that the science has to be wrong because your Bible (written by man) says “this, that, and the other thing”.You ask questions . science supply answers. Most you accept. Those that deal with evolution however .

Well it seems that perhaps we have come full circle. There is no way for you to KNOW you are right without being able to define "Kinds". So have at it Faith...provide us, at long last, with this definition so we all too can KNOW you are right. Who do I send my check to . Pat Robertson, Jimmy Swaggert, Oral Roberts, Jerry Falwell, Pat Buchanan, Benny Hinn? And to think, all this time I just thought these guys were after my money so they could have big houses and nice cars, and maybe a museum or amusement park named after themselves. Silly me.

Hi Faith: Let me be right up front about this; I cannot compete with you on knowing many, if not all, of the relevant passages of the Bible...but let me ask you this. Does it specifically say anywhere in the Bible that man is not genetically related to apes? I'd be surprised if it did, which to me basically means that you really can't make such a claim...seeing as how you take the Bible as the literal word of God. And if he didn't actually say it, then why do you assume it to be true?