Black Rednecks and White Liberals (by Thomas Sowell)

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Secondly, and more importantly, FOX news isn't named "Conservative television," one, because it isn't geared towards that demographic, and secondly, it isn't exclusive to anyone.

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A few years ago, I was in Tokyo to attend the wedding of a lifelong friend of my husband's.At the time, this friend taught at a branch of the University of Maryland in Tokyo that was funded by the US military, so technically, he was a civilian employee of the military. Through his employment status, he was able to reserve some rooms for us at a military hotel in the middle of the city.There were only a couple of US channels on the televisions in the rooms; CNN and FOX.Before CNN News came on, there was a message on the screen that warned the person watching the TV in the hotel room (most likely to be a memeber of the US military) that some of the views expressed or news presented on the program might not be entirely supportive of the war in Iraq.You know what was shown at the start of every FOX News broadcast?No warning about any "unsupportive" views or news, of course.As the music came up and the announcer came on, you heard him say, and you read the words as they appeared on the screen superimposed over an American flag, "FOX News; Part of the Team!"Now, just what do you think they meant by calling themselves, "Part of the Team"?Does that sound like they aren't "geared towards any demographic"?

You may not agree, NJ, but it's true. A year or two ago, a couple friends and I went skateboarding downtown. I live in the Historic Northeast, which, if you've ever been to Kansas City, is just blocks away from downtown. We left in the early to mid evening, 6 or 7, and were still downtown at around 10 or 11 when a police cruiser approached us. We thought we would be in trouble for staying out so late or for skating downtown, which is illegal, but the cops pulled over and told us how dangerous it was to be downtown at such a late hour. They told us that just last night someone was stabbed and robbed not a block away. They even offered to drive us home! We didn't exactly take their advice - we were leaving anyway - but we left, and the whole way home we joked about how if we were black, they wouldn't have said anything. It's not really funny, though, because it's true. There are countless black people all over downtown Kansas City after dark, but they don't bother warning them how dangerous it is. We were committing a crime!That's a privilege. When a police officer takes you under his wing and offers you his safety merely because you're white. When he ignores the illegal actions occurring right in front of his face because you're white. It's a privilege and it's racist. You seemed to dismiss this as if it weren't true or unimportant. But how many times have you heard someone say, in an interview or in everyday conversation, "As a black person, how do you feel about..."? How many times have you heard, "As a white person, how do you feel about..."? Perhaps I took this differently than you, NJ, but I don't think it's exclusive to children's books. In high school, what do the students read? Dickens, Dostoyevsky, Shakespeare, Faulkner, Melville. All white. The only widely read book with a black author that I can think of is Native Son.NJ, in my sophomore year of high school I took an African-American History course. Do you think that's racist?

Thanks NJ. I hope you will not hesitate to moderate me also if you see where it might be wise and beneficial to the board at large. Hopefully we can work to establish a good image for the creo team here at EvC.

1. Perhaps if you were in a predominanly black area where the police had experienced a history of danger to vulnerable loner whites unable to protect themselves, they had good reason according to past observation for the warning.2. Perhaps also if you were blacks in a rougher predominantly white area known for drugs/violence the same police would offer the same warning to you.3. Racism has forever in human history been a natural tendency among the races when humans attempt to mix racially. That is evident in the churches and schools today. Check out the churches where there's no government mandate to integrate. White's by and large tend by choice to attend white churches and black's tendency is to choose to attend black churches. It's natural. I don't see why the naturalist science minded folks act as though it's such an unusual and awful thing for the racism tendency among humans.You're not going to find me alone with my wife or a friend on the streets in one of the notorious black areas of any city. Nor would I want to lurk in a notorious white area, though due to the reality of the race factor, if I were black, likely I'd be somewhat safer in the rough black area and vise versa for the white in the rough white area.I'm not sure if this has any bearing on the Sowell book. My apologies to NJ if not, but as NJ has noted, the thread's quite derailed as it is as he's been obliged to respond to a lot of nitpickin off the topic rabbit trails. Posting no response, persistent opponents probably would protest.

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BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW ---- Jesus said, "When these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads, for your redemption draws near." Luke 21:28

Perhaps perhaps perhaps, but we all know those scenarios are pretty unlikely. We all know that cops treat white people differently than minorities. Getting the benefit of the doubt is a white privilege. Being assumed guilty until proven innocent is how minorities are treated by police. Nobody's saying it's unusual - being racist is the most natural thing in the world. It's the flip side of kin selection - we're inclined to be charitable to those who look like us (which are most likely our relatives) and less so to humans who look different.But just because racism is the most natural thing in the world doesn't make it the right way to live, and it's astounding that you would suggest that it is, Buz. It's quite surprising how quickly you came out in support of racism, but nobody who'd ever seen the crushing effects of racism on the human spirit would ever suggest that racism was anything but awful.Bad show, Buz. I'd had some respect for you as a moderator but I can't respect someone who stands up for racism.

Buz:Please get someone to read this to you and to try explaining it in little words. Perhaps then you might understand it. If you don't understand it at first, get them to repeat it for you or maybe even draw pictures. If you ask nice, they may even let you use the big crayons. Try to stay in the lines.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This is a good point, and one I hold no contention with. It is, however, ultimately the fault of racism and de facto segregation. This is entirely possible, though much less likely than the situation I experienced. A black man in a white neighborhood is almost always a suspect, and almost never a victim. I doubt anyone thinks it's unusual, but just because something is natural and ordinary doesn't mean it's good. Racism is natural, and has always been a part of society, but that doesn't mean we have to keep it that way.In hindsight, I feel my example was a bad choice on my part. One single, isolated incident of racist cops. Though I do feel it reflects fairly well the attitude of society as a whole.You're probably right about being off topic. This thread is about the book, and the arguments put forth in the book. If NJ feels that I or anyone else are off topic he could certainly say so.

If you'd communicate nice we might talk. Otherwise you can take a walk.

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BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW ---- Jesus said, "When these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads, for your redemption draws near." Luke 21:28

I've read several times in this thread about an "unwillingness to learn" that pervades black culture. There is no such thing. Sure, there are always some who give up on school, flunk out, drop out, etc. But there are people like that, people with an "unwillingness to learn", in every race, in every culture. It's not unique to black culture, nor is it disproportionate among blacks.I know my posts in this thread have consisted almost entirely of anecdotes, but just bear with me this one last time. This "unwillingness to learn" isn't something you can document in any empirical form.As I've said before, I go to a predominantly black school in a predominantly black neighborhood. My school is different than most inner-city schools, however, in that it is a college prep school with a college prep curriculum. If you get lower than a 2.5 GPA, you're out. We're the "cream of the crop", as our administrators love to remind us. The majority of the graduates from my school go to college. Most of the people in my grade that I regularly talk to plan to go to college. There are several that don't; I know quite a few people who plan to join the military; a couple want to be rappers. But the rest want to go to college.One of my best (female, black) friends lives in a terrible neighborhood. On New Year's Eve she had to be home at eleven o' clock, "before the shooting starts". When she found out that the school installed security cameras all across the building over the summer, she started a Facebook group called, "31 cameras and no new textbooks". She hates her neighborhood. She wants out. She's willing to learn if that can help her get away from her poverty-stricken and crime-afflicted home.Another (black) friend of mine and I were discussing where we might go to college. When I told her I wanted to stay in Kansas City, she said, "Why? So you can get shot?" She, too, lives in a bad neighborhood. She, too, wants out. She, too, is willing to learn.The truth is there is next to nobody who doesn't want out. Some might be more motivated than others. Some might have better luck (and luck it is when you're 50% less likely to be hired for a job than a white man with the same qualifications). Smearing all blacks with the label "unwilling to learn" is just a way for white conservatives to pass on blame from themselves, when really it's their fault blacks are in this predicament, regardless of how willing they are to learn. Even if blacks were lazy and unwilling to learn, it would still be up to whites to help solve the problem they created. I know it hurts, but it's the truth. Get used to it.

Crash, I've had a number of friends over the years and still do, including beloved Christian brothers and sisters in Christ. By your own admission we all have a racial tendency so don't try to use that to attempt to malign me.Racial is not hateful. I believe God created the races at Bable in the Genesis record for his own purpose, so imo, God, the creator was the first racist perse. Personally I'd prefer my children to have spouces of similar race due to this natural racial tendency, but would be ever as congenial to their spouse if they had married one of another color. Most (abe: both black and white) agree about their own children whether or not they would say so.I would be inclined to treat a black neighbor equally as well as one of my own race. My son has a fine black neighbor family next door to him down south whom we both regard very highly.I voted for Allen Keys, a black when he ran for president solely on the basis that he would have represented my views more than any of the other candidates. Edited by Buzsaw, : No reason given.

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BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW ---- Jesus said, "When these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads, for your redemption draws near." Luke 21:28

Standing up for that tendancy, though is racist.We have a natural tendancy to lie, cheat, and steal, too; but you don't see me standing up for those, do you? You have an idiosyncratic reading of the Bible.And, ladies and gentlemen of the jury, note the coded language flags of the racist:

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Crash, I've had a number of friends over the years and still do,

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"Some of my best friends are black"

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Most agree about their own children whether or not they would say so.

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"I'm just saying what everyone is thinking"The truth of the matter is, Buz, you're way out on your own on this. People simply aren't as racist as you are - or, if they are, at least most people have the decency not to defend those tendancies. You're just desperately hoping that your daughter doesn't marry a black man, is all. Alan Keyes the racist homobigot? Shocking.Look, people, this isn't hard. If you think black people are just fine over there but God forbid one try to work at your workplace, or eat at your lunch counter, or drink from your fountain, or marry into your family - you're a racist. It's amazing that an adult has to be told that in the 21st century.

1. Perhaps the stats are that per capita blacks have a higher crime rate percentage.2. Almost always? I doubt that and btw, I wonder what percentage of the time do the arrested suspects turn out to be the wrong person? Likely not a high percentage overall. Cops usually do sufficient investigating, surveilance, et al before arresting to get the goods so as to keep their job and keep out of hot water.3. Likely cops are more prone to care in dealing with blacks than with whites because of the racist accusations by black suspects which tend to get cops in hot water.

In fact the exact opposite is true - complaints against cops for racism are almost always immediately dismissed.

by the same logic, ABC must be conservative--it hosts the 700 Club, the anchorman being religious nut Pat Robertson (think that's the name. anyhow, dude who called for assassination of a South American pres. cause he was communist).oh, but wait, these stations put in "the views and opinions of this show are not necessarily that of the station". especially when a liberal station is hosting an extremely religious and conservative news show, and a conservative station (which Fox is) play the Simpsons and Family Guy.

this man, pres Lincoln, originally wanted to ship all the blacks out of the US. why did he end slavery? political reason. The South is busy trying to get Britain to officially enter the war, on the side of the South. Up to this point, the war has not been about ending slavery. In fact, it has been denied that that is a focus at the time. The war is solely about getting the CSA together with the USA.How can lincoln prevent the entrance of GB? simple. make it about slavery. we're ending slavery. a very popular idea with poor masses who can identify w/slavery in Europe. Now then, when do reveal this aim? At a great Union Victory. The Proclomation was written much earlier than when it was revealed. I want to say written in 1862, released in 1863 after Gettysburg. could be wrong on specific battle, though. At this point, the South needs Britain or it WILL lose. But Britain refuses to enter, because of the proclomation. how can it justify fighting a war to protect slavery to its people?so your comment that a white guy rescued them all? it wasn't out of the goodness of his heart--he wanted to ship them out of america. he initially wasn't even pro-abolition. he ended it for political reasosns--preservation of the Union.