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Author Topic:   Peppered Moths and Natural Selection
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 306 of 350 (670613)
08-16-2012 2:04 PM
Reply to: Message 305 by Big_Al35
08-16-2012 8:49 AM


However, when the circumstances change and become favourable these traits will be manifested again. Mendels examples include the return of green and wrinkly recessive traits in subsequent generations.

I'm not quite sure what you are saying here, and you did not link to any past discussion. Are you suggesting that individual moths are changing their appearance in response to the environmental changes? That is not what Mendel demonstrated.

If instead you are suggesting that the ability to produce a dark (or light colored) moth is present in the population, but is recessive, then you are not expressing an issue with natural selection which is merely a screening process, but with mutation which is a source of diversity.

But again, I don't know which if either of the above is your actual point. Please clarify.


Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)

The apathy of the people is enough to make every statue leap from its pedestal and hasten the resurrection of the dead. William Lloyd Garrison.

“Choose silence of all virtues, for by it you hear other men's imperfections, and conceal your own.” George Bernard Shaw


This message is a reply to:
 Message 305 by Big_Al35, posted 08-16-2012 8:49 AM Big_Al35 has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 308 by Big_Al35, posted 08-17-2012 3:52 AM NoNukes has responded

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


(1)
Message 324 of 350 (670748)
08-18-2012 9:58 AM
Reply to: Message 308 by Big_Al35
08-17-2012 3:52 AM


Plonk
Discussion with you isn't worth the effort.

I don't need a definition of natural selection. I know what natural selection is. What I don't understand is what sequence of events you are attempting to call natural selection or your references to Mendel's work.

I asked questions because I hoped you'd make your position more clear. Instead you elected to deal out insults to a complete stranger.


Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)

The apathy of the people is enough to make every statue leap from its pedestal and hasten the resurrection of the dead. William Lloyd Garrison.

“Choose silence of all virtues, for by it you hear other men's imperfections, and conceal your own.” George Bernard Shaw


This message is a reply to:
 Message 308 by Big_Al35, posted 08-17-2012 3:52 AM Big_Al35 has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 326 by Big_Al35, posted 08-19-2012 10:05 AM NoNukes has not yet responded

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


(2)
Message 344 of 350 (670960)
08-21-2012 11:05 AM


Summation. Topic was never about speciation.
From the original post

And thus we see agreement that this example is about the Natural Selection part of evolution, and not about speciation, and further that it cannot be about speciation because it is talking about the relative size of populations of two varieties of the same species of moth.

Hopefully the conclusions won't all be about Big_Al's last couple of posts. I thought RAZD did a great job of outlining the myths about the peppered moths and debunking the creationist take on what was actually observed. Of course that was accomplished about 6 or so years ago.


Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)

The apathy of the people is enough to make every statue leap from its pedestal and hasten the resurrection of the dead. William Lloyd Garrison.

“Choose silence of all virtues, for by it you hear other men's imperfections, and conceal your own.” George Bernard Shaw


  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


(3)
Message 349 of 350 (838307)
08-18-2018 4:19 PM


Once a stupid, fact denying creationist, always a fact denying creationist.

I just read a summary by Faith that failed to address any of the evidence given in this thread the Mendelian genetics cannot explain the peppered moth. If, in fact, the goal of the thread was to convince a creationist of anything, it would be un utter failure.

But in my view, threads like this are a smashing success. You can predict the dissembling and denial filled behavior of creationists in the OP of a thread, and then watch it in action at the end of the thread.


Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)

"Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free, the wretched refuse of your teeming shore. Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed to me, I lift my lamp beside the golden door!”

We got a thousand points of light for the homeless man. We've got a kinder, gentler, machine gun hand. Neil Young, Rockin' in the Free World.

Worrying about the "browning of America" is not racism. -- Faith

I hate you all, you hate me -- Faith

No it is based on math I studied in sixth grade, just plain old addition, substraction and multiplication. -- ICANT


  
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