Register | Sign In


Understanding through Discussion


EvC Forum active members: 65 (9164 total)
6 online now:
Newest Member: ChatGPT
Post Volume: Total: 916,437 Year: 3,694/9,624 Month: 565/974 Week: 178/276 Day: 18/34 Hour: 2/2


Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
Author Topic:   On Transitional Species (SUMMATION MESSAGES ONLY)
lyx2no
Member (Idle past 4738 days)
Posts: 1277
From: A vast, undifferentiated plane.
Joined: 02-28-2008


Message 88 of 314 (508370)
05-12-2009 7:14 PM
Reply to: Message 86 by Trev777
05-12-2009 6:36 PM


WHAT
the Bible is peppered with science.
-Gen 1v1 In the Beginning (TIME), God created the Heavens (SPACE) and the earth (MATTER).....V2 and God
said let there be light (ENERGY).
The first Days work, -TIME SPACE MATTER AND ENERGY.
Why looky here Tin Tin is peppered with science too. Ships: buoyancy; Rockets: Newton's Third law; Steam engines: Carnot's therom; Knock-out gas: diffusion.
Dude, with your standard of "science" there isn't a thing written that isn't peppered with science.
'Twas brillig, and the slithy toves
Did gyre and gimble in the wabe;
All mimsy were the borogoves,
And the mome raths outgrabe.
Brillig: TIME
Gyre: ANGULAR MOMENTUM
Are we on to something or what?

It is far easier for you, as civilized men, to behave like barbarians than it was for them, as barbarians, to behave like civilized men. Spock, Mirror Mirror

This message is a reply to:
 Message 86 by Trev777, posted 05-12-2009 6:36 PM Trev777 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 94 by Trev777, posted 05-14-2009 6:12 PM lyx2no has replied

  
lyx2no
Member (Idle past 4738 days)
Posts: 1277
From: A vast, undifferentiated plane.
Joined: 02-28-2008


Message 96 of 314 (508570)
05-14-2009 9:27 PM
Reply to: Message 94 by Trev777
05-14-2009 6:12 PM


Anything on Topic
I ain't speaking to you.
Yet another example of your capacity for contradiction.
Genetic variability was built right into the bacteria. Was this by mutation -No, resistant forms were already present.
This indicates that you are under the impression that the mutations don't occur until a change in the environment calls for them. That is not the case. A particular mutation might have happened a hundred thousand generations ago that was harmless and meaningless until a change in the environment, per chance, made it useful (or harmful). Say a gene is modified so that the protein it makes can now also bind with a certain chemical. A thousand years later an antibiotic is discovered that, per chance, uses that very chemical. Any germ that just happens to have the modified version of the gene can render the antibiotic ineffective. Guess what happens next Cha-ching selection for the modified gene. Now how hard was that?
Aside from it having nothing to do with the topic, transitional species, why, if I can think of a naturalistic way for something to occur within a matter of minutes, do you not think evolution couldn't stumble upon it with trillions of chances over millions of generations, and even go so far as to call it impossible?
BTW, this is an open forum. If you're speaking, you're speaking to everyone.
Edited by lyx2no, : No reason given.
Edited by lyx2no, : Remove redundancy.

It is far easier for you, as civilized men, to behave like barbarians than it was for them, as barbarians, to behave like civilized men. Spock, Mirror Mirror

This message is a reply to:
 Message 94 by Trev777, posted 05-14-2009 6:12 PM Trev777 has not replied

  
lyx2no
Member (Idle past 4738 days)
Posts: 1277
From: A vast, undifferentiated plane.
Joined: 02-28-2008


Message 103 of 314 (508858)
05-16-2009 7:49 PM
Reply to: Message 102 by Trev777
05-16-2009 5:51 PM


Mutation and Environment Drive Transitions
The problem is -natural selection is a blind process that cannot see ahead to select a new improoved function.
This is merely an argument for irreducible complexity. None of the steps that went into making what was to eventually become a wing was without contemporary value. To be sure, a harmful mutation will be selected against: like wearing a Yankee's cap in Boston; but, that's neutral in most environments and beneficial in some. There is no shortage of environments on this ever changing planet.
natural selection would eliminate it as having no function.
NS does not eliminate mutations that have no function. It eliminates mutations that are harmful. NS recognizes the cost/benefit must be positive, but if the cost is meager the benefit needn't be pronounced.
the idea that each chance increment being more fit than the last is statistically impossible.
Only if one is restricted to a single environment could this possibly be the case. The short limbs of the Inuit would be a disaster on a basketball court, but throw one of Da Vinci's scythemobiles into the mix and you got yourself a whole 'nother ball game.
each involves a loss of information.
Not! What makes a bit of information in a gene information is that it produces a secondary effect. If a change in the gene causes a different secondary effect it is still information. Environmental pressures determine whether the new information is boon, bust or blazé.
In time unless the mutation can be selected out this leads to extinction of the species.
They are selected out if they decrease the likelihood of reproduction. Genes go extinct regularly. They don't have to take the species with it.
To change an ape-like gene into a human-like gene you need to know the whole DNA information sequence in advance.
Unlike videos of ones Mum stepping in dog poop in her Sunday shoes, this doesn't get better with repetition. We were not a goal. Evolution didn't care where it ended up. You throw a dart at random and stand amazed at the specialness of the spot it hit neglecting that it had to hit somewhere.
I won't mention maths again incase I get suspended , but evolution just dosen't add up.
It is your use of pseudo-math that is objectionable. Your use of "statistically impossible" at the end of the second paragraph is sound and fury signifying nothing. How do you know what the odds are? I see you making one after the next erroneous assumption. If these are what you're plugging into your equations you're doing your own math, right? then it's not surprising that you keep getting answers that do not comport to the reality right before your eye.
Edited by lyx2no, : Typos.

It is far easier for you, as civilized men, to behave like barbarians than it was for them, as barbarians, to behave like civilized men.
Spock: Mirror Mirror

This message is a reply to:
 Message 102 by Trev777, posted 05-16-2009 5:51 PM Trev777 has not replied

  
Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2023 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.2
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2024