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Author Topic:   How well do we understand DNA?
Sylas
Member (Idle past 5281 days)
Posts: 766
From: Newcastle, Australia
Joined: 11-17-2002


Message 6 of 98 (177473)
01-16-2005 4:27 AM
Reply to: Message 3 by RAZD
01-16-2005 1:48 AM


RAZD writes:
3. Personally I don’t think any DNA is junk, just that the purpose is not known or understood enough. Consider that it takes a considerable expenditure of energy to produce these sequences, and that if they did not serve a purpose that they would be eligible for being weeded out by selection, especially in stressed populations (starving, insufficient nutrients, etc), and that is not happening.
There is some indication that sheer bulk of DNA carries some selective benefit. Bases added to DNA simply for the sake of bulk are legitimately called junk.
Sample reference of many: Cavalier-Smith, T. Skeletal DNA and the evolution of genome size. Annu. Rev. Biophys. Bioeng. 11:273-302 (1982). Ref pinched from bibliography of Evolutionary Principles of Genomic Compression by David C. Krakauer.
We also know that different parts of the genome have different selective pressures. Some sequences are highly conserved; others are not. In fact, this is one way of identifying sequences that have some importance, even if we don't know their role! One mystery is that some high conserved sequences were deleted from mice, with no apparent effect. This remains a mystery.
Ref: Are Ultra-conserved Elements Indispensable? by Dr Mae-Wan Ho (ISIS press release, 16/09/04).
But by comparison there are other parts of the genome where mutations accumulate at pretty much the same rate as they arise, indicating no selective pressures at work. This is indirect evidence for junk, I suggest.
Cheers -- Sylas

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3 by RAZD, posted 01-16-2005 1:48 AM RAZD has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 8 by RAZD, posted 01-16-2005 10:17 AM Sylas has not replied
 Message 21 by TheLiteralist, posted 01-23-2005 12:42 AM Sylas has not replied

  
Sylas
Member (Idle past 5281 days)
Posts: 766
From: Newcastle, Australia
Joined: 11-17-2002


Message 17 of 98 (177870)
01-17-2005 2:21 PM
Reply to: Message 16 by crashfrog
01-17-2005 12:19 PM


This is an intriguing arguement by crashfrog, but flawed. The measure of 1 mutation per hundred base pairs per generation (actually, the real figure is more like 1 per 108 base pairs) is itself a measure of a stochastic process. If you have a genome with 6 by 109 base pairs, it means that you get about 60 mutations per generation. It could be more, and it could be less, but the average is 60.
Crashfrog's argument assumes that the organism will have exactly that many mutations, and that is the error.
Increasing genome length does not change the probability of mutations in the bits you care about.
Cheers -- Sylas

This message is a reply to:
 Message 16 by crashfrog, posted 01-17-2005 12:19 PM crashfrog has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 18 by crashfrog, posted 01-17-2005 5:52 PM Sylas has replied

  
Sylas
Member (Idle past 5281 days)
Posts: 766
From: Newcastle, Australia
Joined: 11-17-2002


Message 19 of 98 (178053)
01-18-2005 6:37 AM
Reply to: Message 18 by crashfrog
01-17-2005 5:52 PM


No, no! Don't give up so easily! Damn... the creationists are more fun. Other folks keep learning stuff way too quickly.
(Apologies to the creationists here who do learn things from time to time... I know the above is a cheap shot.)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 18 by crashfrog, posted 01-17-2005 5:52 PM crashfrog has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 20 by crashfrog, posted 01-18-2005 8:30 PM Sylas has not replied

  
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