What are you? EvC poll

Perhaps another way to look a natural is that it is really -----natural. In other words, everything is supernatural, but when your understanding is only partial (which ours will forever be) then you don't observe the 'super'(which always attaches to 'natural') and conclude quite -----naturally, that it is only -----natural.Hence MonismHence the bibles term: the "natural man" (used to describe the spiritually blind)This message has been edited by iano, 04-May-2006 04:46 PM

This is a good candidate for an OP. You should start on thread on this question.First thing that enters my head is what about moving pictures. You go and see a series of stills flashed on a screen and perceive motion. This is just an example. It is established that atoms are mostly space so what is solidity?So what do you mean by experience? Sensory perception? Memory?lfen

Robin's was the 42nd post in this thread. And he asked this particular question. Eerie!(For those of us to whom it means something: could this be the ultimate question of the Universe, Life & Everything?)This message has been edited by Parasomnium, 04-May-2006 08:14 PM

How did we get on this subject again ?

I can't start any more threads right now. First I have to figure out how something can come from nothing. That may take awhile.Maybe YOU should start a thread.I think, ifen, that you may be a philosophical idealist.

Robin was maybe-ing. As was I

I'd ask my knower and leave it at that. Call it Occams Razor. Its much quicker. Just because someone says black is in fact white doesn't mean you have to think about it for too long Given what your attempting to figure out, I don't see a whole lot of difference between youThis message has been edited by iano, 04-May-2006 11:25 PM

I mean he thinks that reality is mental in nature (or "spiritual"--same thing). I don't think that.

Ah..I took it that "philospophical idealist" meant someone who could arrive at an ideal (truth), philosophically. Which is what you perpetually seem to require (ad hom not intended)I cannot help the notion that unless a solution is generated from within RR's own brain it will never be found acceptable. This might or might not gel with a tract you may or may not have had shoved in your hand at some point by some eager-evangelical: depicting A Throne.... and your relative position (desired and actual)This message has been edited by iano, 05-May-2006 12:39 AM

If you mean I try to figure things out, I do. Quite seriously. It doesn't have to come from me (although that would be nice), as long as it makes sense. I could read it in a book, for example. I get ideas from books, lots of them.But the rule is, I have to be able to understand it.

I know you do, seriously. And no matter how long you continue, there will exist evermore books with evermore new ideas (none of which are actually). You will never conclude until the day you die. You could hardly, having done all that, come up with a more ignorant and vacuous dying word as those of an acknowledged genius such as Richard Feynman (assuming they are true) Maybe its time to quit surfing broad and to pick that which seems to make the best (hazy) sense to date. And take the plunge in going deeper.Time waits for no man

That's a good quote but I like this one even better: As to vacuous and ignorant I think your statement is a revealing projection on your part but tells us nothing about Feynman.lfenedited due to misclicking before finishedThis message has been edited by lfen, 05-04-2006 08:02 PM

That is ususally the position I am working on. Though I am also trying to figure out if there are aspects to matter/energy that with sufficient complexity gives rise to consciousness as an emergent phenomena. That is to say does energy have some kind of inner qualities that an organism with a nervous system can access as qualia?lfen

This would be an "intrinsic difference" argument and so would relate to the second part of my post.

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"The good Christian should beware the mathematician and all those who make empty prophecies. The danger already exists that the mathematicians have made a covenant with the devil to darken the spirit and to confine man in the bonds of hell." - St. Augustine

Actually, you make a good point, iano. This amateur philosophizing is rather ridiculous.