Oh my how things have changed!!!

For a more accurate view of the times, look at The Grapes of Wrath, not The Waltons.There was never any innocence to lose. (Watch me struggle not to mention "the Fall".)

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Yes.There have always been some individuals who were "innocent" - i.e. ignorant - of a lot of what goes on. But the human race as a whole has never been "innocent". That's one thing that has not changed much. In advertising, all women seem to care about is having brighter laundry, killing more germs and feeling "fresh". Even the female CEO only cares about not letting a headache ruin her day. Can you imagine Donald Trump even acknowledging a headache?

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But what's the "reason" to worry in today's society?Forty or fifty years ago, people didn't worry about their kids being abducted, etc. because they never heard about such things happening. Today, if a kid is molested in any way, anywhere in the world, it's on every front page and every TV set within hours.It isn't happening more, we just hear about it more.If you think we are less safe today, read about some of the horrific "true crimes" that happened a hundred years ago.

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Two things:First, the usage of the word "homophobe" doesn't necessarily refer to "fear" per se. A phobia is an irrational fear or aversion. "Homophobe" is generally used to emphasize the irrationality rather than the fear.(If we were going by the strict etymology of the word, it would be something like "fear of sameness" - with no reference to sexuality at all.)Second, the fear that "homophobe" does imply is not necessarily a fear of being accosted by queer gangs and given a makeover. It's often a fear that same-sex marriage will "make a mockery of the institution of marriage" - which is a very real fear.So, I think on both counts riVeRraT is definitely a homophobe.I would hesitate to say whether or not your "severe distaste" qualifies as a phobia. Myself, I have a severe distaste for cashews, but I wouldn't call it a phobia. I also have a fear of heights, but I wouldn't call that a phobia either. On the other hand, I also have a fear of spiders, which is definitely a phobia.I do agree that riVeRraT is often given a hard time by some (present company included), but it's mostly because of his own ham-fisted approach.

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Somewhere up above, we touched very briefly on the "fear of phobias". If somebody laughs at me for my fear of spiders, I don't consider that a personal "attack" - it is funny. So why do some people have such an aversion to just being called "homophobe"? I'll venture to speak for gay people until they come out of the closet to correct me. I suspect they do think there is only a very fine line between those "good ole boys" and people who say, "I don't like gays, but I'll deign to let them live". I think a lack of interest in homosexuality is perfectly normal. A lack of understanding of homosexuality is also perfectly normal. But a "severe distaste" for something you can easily avoid certainly does seem irrational. (And it often indicates latent homosexual tendencies, blah blah blah.) The two don't necessarily have to go hand-in-hand. (Perish the thought.) If it walks like a duck and talks like a duck, it might be Jim Carrey.But a lot of the time it's a duck.

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But it's two different things: My fear of heights isn't irrational because I could fall and get hurt. On the other hand, your fear of gays is irrational. What can a gay person do to hurt you that any other human being couldn't do? (I guess if it was a really tall gay person, you could fall off and get hurt. ) I don't think that's true. Have we seen you express as much concern about marriage in general as you do about same-sex marriage? Well, I'm openly admitting my fear and you're not. And my fear doesn't prompt me to post on the Internet that "I don't agree with heights". See, there go your latent homosexual tendencies again. Yes you are. Well done.Now if you could learn to overcome the fear of fear itself....

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I didn't say you were afraid of gay people - I said you were afraid of being called "homophobic".
It makes no difference whether you are homophobic or not.
You have a fear that people will think you are.My example was that I am afraid of heights, but I don't mind acknowledging that fear. As far as EvC is concerned, everything.All we know about you is what you tell us. What you really feel is irrelevant unless you can express it unequivocally. And nobody is forcing you to participate in them. Take responsibility for your own actions. If that was really your fear, you'd probably want to be more careful about what you say, instead of using "I'm a New Yorker" as an excuse.

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Not from me, you won't.
Your position against same-sex marriage is too ludicrous to be called "hate".

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Have you been taking reading lessons from riVeRraT?I think it's pretty clear that he is a homophobe.
What does that have to do with calling you a homophobe?In spite of his loud protestations, riVeRraT does come across as a homophobe. Unfortunately, he chooses to be defensive about the label instead of trying to alter the perception.

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I also called him a "New Yorker". Are you expecting that label too? I didn't say that he "has" to alter the perception, or even that he "should". I said that if he doesn't like the way people perceive him, it's his responsibility to try to change their minds. If only there was a place where you could look up the meanings of words. As I've been saying: if you're concerned about how you "come across", then be careful how you express yourself. The only picture of you that we have is the one that you paint. Don't make assumptions about what other people understand.I used to be a homophobe myself, so I know the drill. (If anybody still sees homophobic tendencies in me, I have the convenient excuse that I'm not fully "cured" yet. ) If you walk like a duck and talk like a duck, keep your head down during hunting season.

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As gasby has been trying to explain, "hate" doesn't always involve chopping people up with an axe. Trying to dictate who they can and cannot marry is pretty hateful too. Tell me about it. It seems like every second sentence I post starts out, "My point is...."
If only I could paint a point that looks like a point. So I know more about it than you do. And I shoot at anything that moves.

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And yet the title of the thread is "Oh my how things have changed!!!" (and in only a few short years). Reports of "our demise" are greatly exaggerated.
Until we actually do demise, it's premature to diagnose the cause.

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So, you're endorsing poly-partner, interspecies marriage....But can it be a same-sex monkey?

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