Haggard Scandal

You are a god, archer.

Are you saying that human beings should obey their desires and not try to control them?It's an interesting idea really. Let's just be who we really are! Is that how we determine what is real?

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"God must know, better than anyone, how unfulfilling it is to be right, until it can be shared, with a community willing to accept it, and enjoy the glory of it."(Rob Lockett)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------Billy Graham was once cornered by a tenatious reporter who asked him his thoughts on the Jim Baker scandal... It was imparted to me that Billy does not like to participate in such discourse as this. But the reporter had him pinned.He responded, (and I paraphrase) "There are thousands of airplanes, some big, some small. They fly thousands of miles and perform all kinds of functions flawlessly, some mundane, others grand... But let one grand jumbo jet crash, and the whole world is gawking at the casualties."

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"God must know, better than anyone, how unfulfilling it is to be right, until it can be shared, with a community willing to accept it, and enjoy the glory of it."(Rob Lockett)

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I don't really know what the Religious Right means. I assume it to mean those like Falwell who politicize their religion. I would say, who cares what they say.

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And Dobson, and Robertson, and the like.Who cares what they say? Millions of Americans, President Bush, and Carl Rove, and the NeoCon Leadership, that's who.

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Shraf, give me a break. I don't tell you "turn or burn, you and your homo friends!"

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So, you're a vocal opponent of any of the religious social conservatives who are in power, and always vote against them when they propose passing laws restricting activities which go against their and your religious convictions?Somehow, I don't think you voted for Gore last time.

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All that you and I have ever done is have discussions about our personal beliefs. My beliefs include what Yahweh says. Aside from arguing my points about theology and philosophy, I don't think I've done anything so egregious to where I'm demanding that you believe what I believe.

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I know you can't demand that I believe what you do, but you can support people who would pass laws to force me to live according to your rules.If you voted for the NeoCons it means that you support the passing of laws that would restrict others' ability to live their lives in the way they see fit on the basis of your personal religious beliefs.

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If you aren't comfortable sharing that much information with almost perfect strangers, that's fine. It does offer a catharsis though.

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Sharing it with strangers would not be cathartic for me.Sharing it with a close friend or family member would be, though.

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Also, if you think that people are going to use that against you some time down the line, I can assure you that I would never do that to you.

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I'm not worried about that. There are just limits upon what I will put on this internet forum, which is a completely public place that can be viewed by anyone with a computer and an internet connection.

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I can't speak for everyone else, but that is off-limits for me. I would be too honored that you shared something so personal. Betrayal of that confidence would be unacceptable for me.

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That's very good of you, thanks.

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Meth is illegal, even in Denver.

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So is prostitution. In Denver.

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It's almost like they are drawn to fight against something they recognise is within themselves. You almost wonder if they think that if they can 'destroy' homosexuality in the wider world it will solve their internal problems. Some psychiatrist should write a book about it.

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It's called "projection".

Yeah it's mostly the name that conjures Irishman, but there was also that he reminded me of an enormous Leprechaun beaming down at me when we met. The facial features. I don't know how tall he was but he must have been quite tall. Of course I might have been stoned myself, having an Alice moment. Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

I was not surprised by the fact that Ted Haggard may have had gay sex and paid for it.

I was not surprised that Ted Haggard bought meth and that he probably used it.

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What sickened me and continues to hurt me is the fact that this leader of a church of 15,000 can't even tell the truth about it all.

I can see how Robertson fits in that criteria, but I've never really understood why Dobson is so despised by the irreligious. And to think, they should be listening to the tirades of Michael Moore. I vote for who I think will perform the best job and a sound ethical standard. All that I said was I have objections to politicizing Jesus. I don;t how that turned into what you described. Kerry was last one. I voted for neither. But I did have the fortune of meeting John Kerry and telling him that he and his running mate had better hair than his opposition. He was visibly irritated and walked away from me to shake the hands of his supporters. Nothing forces you to live as I do. But if that really were the case, wouldn't that imposition be the same for me? I see it as them trying to pass laws that protect its citizens. Even the most liberal of Democrats wants that. We just differ in our opinion of what we best support and defend its citizens. Fair enough.

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I can't speak for everyone else, but that is off-limits for me. I would be too honored that you shared something so personal. Betrayal of that confidence would be unacceptable for me.

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Not a problem.

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"The weapons of our warfare are not carnal but mighty in God for pulling down strongholds, casting down arguments and every high thing that exalts itself against the knowledge of God." -2^nd Corinthians 10:4-5

Dobson is a joke to the religious as well. He is an embarrassment to Christianity.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

Okay, but why do you think so? What does he do that's so awful?

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"The weapons of our warfare are not carnal but mighty in God for pulling down strongholds, casting down arguments and every high thing that exalts itself against the knowledge of God." -2^nd Corinthians 10:4-5

There are no "laws of morality". You have it backwards. It's your "magical maneuvering" that enables you to avoid thinking.

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Focus on the Family. A most frightening organization.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

Disclaimer: I only offer the following, as a means of explaining something irrefutable. I am also not attempting to insult your intelligence. Furthermore, it is not an attempt by me to be right. I cannot be right. Neither can you. This argument is not just mine; it is yours also. It is the basis of all 'logic'; The law of non-contradiction. It is right, and we both use it. It holds that a contradictory statement cannot be true (unless it is qualified in some manner). You just used the law of non-contradiction by making an affirmation. The only reason yours failed, was because of the attempt to affirm a negative.Other absolute negations include:1. There is no truth.2. There is no God.3. There are no blue stones with black dots in the universe.To make the point clearer... you are positing an absolute, while denying that absolutes exist. As such, I must ask a very important question:Is it wrong for me to say that there are laws of morality? And I mean for everybody...Please answer carefully... If you are right, then you prove the law of non-contradiction by inferring that I am wrong and you are right. That is the law of non-contradiction. We cannot both be right!But you are not right, because you are using the law of non-contradiction against itself, and that is pure nonsense.
A house divided against itself cannot stand! It rests on sand.But a house built on the rock, can endure the storm.Thinking is very shallow and simple. It is basic, and base. It is academic. It is careful. It is sound.And it is despised... because the devil is in the details, and he cannot hide from those who can see. God didn't make fig leaves big enough to drown out the light of reason."In coming to understand anything we are rejecting the facts as they are for us, in favour of the facts as they are."
(Lewis of course)Edited by Rob, : No reason given.

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"God must know, better than anyone, how unfulfilling it is to be right, until it can be shared, with a community willing to accept it, and enjoy the glory of it."(Rob Lockett)

Interesting analogy.What we have, though, is more like ten jets crashing---all operated by the same airline. The airline has been reprimanded frequently by the FAA for hiring unqualified personnel, using substandard equipment and ignoring even the most basic safety standards. The airline's ads routinely make extravagant claims but is has always been plagued by lawsuits and audits and its shares occupy the cellar on the stock market. The planes themselves are known to have abyssmal safety records. Each downed jet was shown after its accident to have been held together with spit and Scotch tape. Yet airline executives repeatedly sidestep questions and have yet to make any changes.People do ask questions after accidents like these. Why? Because investigations are proper in such situations. The priority is not revenge or morbid curiosity. The issue is how innocent people may be protected from abuse and exploitation by those charged with ensuring their safety.Airline execs like Mr Graham dislike being summoned as part of the inquiry. But to avoid the subject is a criminal act of neglect when the airline, as he noted, daily puts more passengers in the air.______Edited by Archer Opterix, : HTML.Edited by Archer Opterix, : Typo.Edited by Archer Opterix, : Typo.

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ArcherAll species are transitional.