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Author Topic:   Randomness of evolution?
shadow71
Member (Idle past 2965 days)
Posts: 706
From: Joliet, il, USA
Joined: 08-31-2010


Message 1 of 8 (664420)
05-31-2012 7:15 PM


Wikipedila, Natural Selection writes:
Natural selection is the gradual, non-random, process by which biological traits become either more or less common in a population as a function of differential reproduction of their bearers. It is a key mechanism of evolution.
Variation exists within all populations of organisms. This occurs partly because random mutations cause changes in the genome of an individual organism, and these mutations can be passed to offspring. Throughout the individuals’ lives, their genomes interact with their environments to cause variations in traits. (The environment of a genome includes the molecular biology in the cell, other cells, other individuals, populations, species, as well as the abiotic environment.) Individuals with certain variants of the trait may survive and reproduce more than individuals with other variants. Therefore the population evolves. Factors that affect reproductive success are also important, an issue that Charles Darwin developed in his ideas on sexual selection, for example.
Natural selection acts on the phenotype, or the observable characteristics of an organism, but the genetic (heritable) basis of any phenotype that gives a reproductive advantage will become more common in a population (see allele frequency). Over time, this process can result in populations that specialize for particular ecological niches and may eventually result in the emergence of new species. In other words, natural selection is an important process (though not the only process) by which evolution takes place within a population of organisms. As opposed to artificial selection, in which humans favour specific traits, in natural selection the environment acts as a sieve through which only certain variations can pass.
It seems to me to be irrevelant if mutations are "random" because "natural selection" will choose a benefical mutation.
Thus if natural selection chooses beneficial mutations there is an argument that, in fact, all evolution is guided by some force that leads to the enrichment of all species.
How does a scientist determine the cause or working of "natural selection"?
Is there a scientific possibility that this process is planned?

Replies to this message:
 Message 2 by Admin, posted 06-01-2012 6:08 AM shadow71 has replied

shadow71
Member (Idle past 2965 days)
Posts: 706
From: Joliet, il, USA
Joined: 08-31-2010


Message 3 of 8 (664529)
06-01-2012 5:02 PM
Reply to: Message 2 by Admin
06-01-2012 6:08 AM


Evolution a planned process
There was at some time the Origin of Life and it is unkown how or why life occurred.
Subsequently Evolution began.
Biological evolution is generally defined as descent with modification, occurring by genetic inheritance and all of life shares a common ancestor that led to the diversity of life we witness today.
Some of the mechanisms of evolution are descent, mutation, migration, genetic drift and natural selection.
It is argued that all mutations are random for fitness, except perhaps CRISPRs systems.
Natural selection is not random.
Therefor it is irrevelant, if in fact, all mutations are random for fitness because natural selection will select the "fittest" mutations.
If we do not know how life began, how can we know where DNA, etc originated?
How do we know what caused genes?
Occam's (or Ockham's) razor is a principle attributed to the 14th century logician and Franciscan friar William of Ockham.
To paraphrase, Occam's Razor for scientists is that when you have two competing theories that make the same predictions the simpler one is better.
I submit that when one views the complexity and diversity of all life today and in the past the simpler most probable explanation is that evolution is planned, and not an accident.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2 by Admin, posted 06-01-2012 6:08 AM Admin has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 4 by Admin, posted 06-02-2012 9:06 AM shadow71 has replied

shadow71
Member (Idle past 2965 days)
Posts: 706
From: Joliet, il, USA
Joined: 08-31-2010


Message 5 of 8 (664621)
06-03-2012 9:32 AM
Reply to: Message 4 by Admin
06-02-2012 9:06 AM


Re: Evolution a planned process
Hi Percy,
My premise is that there is no evidence that the beginning of the universe, the "Big Bang", nor the begining of life, arose completely from some "natural phenomenon" and is wholly an accidential happenstance.
Logic leads me to the conclusion that all of what we seen and do not see is not an accident.
Most scientists "believe" that there was nothing before the big bang and many state we will never solve the issuse of how life began.
Therefore I cannot see how it can be stated with any degree of certainity there is no creator.
I am always told "show me the evidence", I ask, show me the evidence for " Accidential randomness."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4 by Admin, posted 06-02-2012 9:06 AM Admin has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 6 by Admin, posted 06-03-2012 10:02 AM shadow71 has replied

shadow71
Member (Idle past 2965 days)
Posts: 706
From: Joliet, il, USA
Joined: 08-31-2010


Message 7 of 8 (664644)
06-03-2012 7:10 PM
Reply to: Message 6 by Admin
06-03-2012 10:02 AM


Re: Evolution a planned process
Hi Percy,
The thread I am interested in is what evidence is there of Accidental randomness in evolultion and if you wish to expand it to the beginning of life and the beginning of the universe.
I am assuming all participants would be allowed to present circumstantial evidence.
It this is unacceptable then I will drop the issue

This message is a reply to:
 Message 6 by Admin, posted 06-03-2012 10:02 AM Admin has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 8 by Admin, posted 06-03-2012 9:17 PM shadow71 has not replied

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