Bill Moyers' Warning About Fundamenatlists

NosyNed, in message 1 of this topic. The quote source is apparently Bill Moyers, talking about some Christian fundamentalist's attitudes: Buzsaw, from Is US Establishing An Islamic Theocracy In Iraq?: I thought that this here topic is a good place to bring the Buzsaw quotation.So Buz, even though you view at least some aspects of the Iraq war as being "logically a mistake", overall was George W. Bush's starting of the Iraq war "a good thing"?Moose

1. Bush was not the only one deceived on WMD's. Most of the world was deceived. In our government the deception and perceived need for war was much on both sides of the political isle.
2. We knew Saddam had used WMD's against the Turks.
3. It is my understanding that Iraq was financing Palestinian suicide bombers.
4. 9/11 was a wakeup call for war against terrorism which Iraq supported.
5. The War On Terror by the Bush admin has likely been one reason there have not been additional attacks in the US. It has been an effective deterrant. Nations supporting terrorism have been put on notice.In summary, yes I would be supportive of the war, but limited to pre-emptive and retaliatory strikes as has been the policy of Israel. We did not occupy and rebuild Yugoslavia. Why should we do it for these Muslim nations? Yugoslavia, imo, was overkill, knocking out the bridges, et al.

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Gravity is God's glue that holds his universe together.

There were many, many of us that were not decieved. Bush was decieved because he rejected any evidence that did not support his preconcieved notions. He was willfully ignorant. Kurds and Marsh Arabs. And??????? There was NO connection between Iraq and 9-11. Anyone surprised that 9-11 happened had to have been living with their head in the ground. Not only was there a best seller Tom Clancy novel that used that plot device, there had actually been an attempt to hijack a plane and fly it into the Eiffle Tower. Possibly. But it has not cut down on the level of terrorism world wide.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

Well I am glad he doesn't represent this Christians view about the world, and our enviroment.I believe God made us lords of the earth, and that God is a Lord of lords. I believe he left us with a great responsibilty to take care of, and the mind to do it. I think we are in greater trouble than we think.
With CO2 at an all time high, global temps up 1 degree, and receeding polar caps, the world needs to wake up now. Bush may become a surfer sooner than later.

Please, not another "Who thought they knew what when" discussion. That is not the intent of this topic in general, and my previous message in specific.A simple question, repeated from my previous message:From your perspective, was George W. Bush's starting of the Iraq war "a good thing"? Yes or No?MooseThis message has been edited by minnemooseus, 01-03-2006 11:59 PM

You should do some reading about who we help with weapons and such. US News had a great article on it awhile back.
War and the government surplus is a booming business.

I disagree.How do you get permission to plunder from this :and replenish the earth,I don't think for one second that God does not want us to take care of the earth.

I think the answer is unclear, and it seems to be based on personal opinion. It is good for some, and not good for others.There appears to be people in Iraq that are very greatful to now be free of Suddam. I know 3 kids who just came back from there, and they all say that the news is not telling the truth about what is going on over there, and they are only showing the bad of it. They felt as though we are doing a good work over there.All war has a bad side, especially losing our kids over there. Then we start to question wtf are we doing?The other thing is how do we measure the sucess of the war? We can't possibly know for sure what we are preventing from happening, only what has actually happened.I hate war, I wish we didn't have to have war. I am in the middle of "is it good or bad".The worst part is now we are at war with people who fight like cowards, and are spread all over the world, and will neverf cease to stop attacking US.Of course the war in IRaq is not supposed to be about terrorism, but it is, and it fuels the terrorists.My question is, how much better would we have done if we would have spent 100billion dollars in a Christian like manor, and just helped them? I bet they wouldn't have even allowed it.Why didn't we just do the whole thing with Special OPS?Why don't we bait the terroists, and beat them at their own game?

You mean, why don't we match brutality with brutality? The deaths of innocents with the deaths of more innocents?Oops, too late. Funny, we've tortured at least 40 people to death, cab drivers and repairmen and the like - not any actual terrorists, that we've been able to tell - and it doesn't seem to quell the terrorists one single bit. Seems to just drive them nuts, in fact.It's one thing to exceed the rules in a crunch situation, when lives are at stake. It's quite another to flaunt the rules out of an enjoyment of power and cruelty, and then use "defense of the state" to justify it. It's a perversion, and a threat to our security. Simple as that.

Please do not take things beyond that fringe.The little Moose (aka "not the cranky moose)

I don't have a clue how you got all that from the idea of baiting a terrorist.try again

Great post by Jar... Very insightful and very true.

You said "beat them at their own game." What else were you talking about? What do you think terrorists do, exactly?

They are sneaky, and do not fight conventional war.Why can't we be smarter than them, without being brutal?Like set up a false embassy in a likely area to get car bombed, and set traps for them. You know, stuff like that.I saw in a documentary that they are using the internet to get their message out, and train more terrorists. Surely with have the brains and know how in this country to attack them in cyberspace. Erase all their hard drives.I still feel the whole war should have been special ops.Got any better ideas?

Here's something nice from Mike OverbeckMike Overbeck - Animation Production* warning, this video depicts sectarian hymn-singing and other atrocities, exercise discretion when viewing