Summations Only

Hi Dr, Are you saying there is not enough water in the mantel to fill the oceans 7 times?How and when did it get there?God Bless,

Hi Trixie, Do you mean verbs can't be used as nouns?In Biblical Hebrew they can and are used as nouns.But either way whether the noun ים is used or the verb ימים is used they are both masculine singular.BTW ימים is the one used in the Hebrew text. Yes the translators only knew about seas so they used seas as they could not envision all the water in one sea. The text is correct the translation is what is wrong. So yes I can argue the text says sea as that is what the word that is used in the Hebrew text means.God Bless,

Hi Percy, You did not question this passage or quote it.

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1:6 And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.

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Debating would be a little easier if the Bibles in the OP was used to quote from.I suppose you are convinced that רקיע is a hammered out dome instead of a firmament or expanse.If so could you please explain how the water that was separated by the expanse we call our atmosphere from the water that surounded the land mass we call planet Earth, could be hammered out into something solid as your dome would be? Easy you just read the text and use the word it uses. You don't try to make the text say anything.רקיע is the Hebrew word used in the text and it is singular and therefore means sea.Therefore He called the body of water that was gathered together in one place a sea.One place could not have any of the 6 landlocked seas we have today as the water would not have been in one place.God Bless,

Hi NoNukes, So are you saying the water was not in one place as the text says? So how do you connect these seas to one body of water?
Aral Sea, Caspian Sea, Dead Sea, Sea of Galilee, Great Salt Lake, and the Salton Sea. Yes we have continents today but we do not have one body of water. One body of water would be one sea. We might call different parts of that one sea by other names but that would not separate the water into different bodies of water. You would have to rule out any of the continents that contain the 6 landlocked seas mentioned above. The flood occured about 1800 years after Genesis 1:9, 10.What could have happened that God did not tell Moses about in that period of time.He did tell him in the days of Peleg it was divided. Well no that is not all I use to support the view that all the land mass was in one place and was divided at a later date.There was one language on the Earth.

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11:1 And the whole earth was of one language, and of one speech.

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The people who were trying to build a tower to heaven had their language confounded and was scattered over the face of the Earth.

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11:8 So the LORD scattered them abroad from thence upon the face of all the earth: and they left off to build the city.

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They were scattered upon the face of ALL the Earth.In Genesis 1:10 the dry land there was called Earth.So if that dry land was one continious piece of dry land there would be no problem with scattering the people or the animals that had survived the flood on the ark over ALL the face of the Earth.If the dry land was then divided into the positions it is at today that would explain why there was people in different parts of the world. It would also explain why all of them had a flood story and worshiped some kind of a god. It would explain why it has been agreed that there was a mother tongue all languages came from. Well until the water was gathered into one place there was no dry land.To have rivers you have to have rain and I don't find any.Rain is mentioned in the 2nd chapter of Genesis that God had not caused it to rain. But rain was not needed as the Earth was watered by a mist that rose from the ground.The only time I find it raining was when the windows of heaven were opened after Noah had entered the ark.So why would there be rivers or lakes?God Bless,

Hi Trixie, I never said the KJV was perfect. I did say it is the best English version we have today.But I included the LXX and the Hebrew text also so the study could use the proper words and meanings of those words. That is what Bible Study is.I did not spend all those years in language class to just accept what someone else says that the Bible text says.God Bless,

Hi Theo, If the waters are connected they would be one body of water regardless of what we call a particular section.God Bless,

Hi NoNukes, You can imagine anything you like. That does not change the fact that they are bodies of water that is not connected to any other ocean or sea.Therefore they would not be considered a part of the water in one place of Genesis 1:9. The land mass could be in any configuration as long as there was not any water landlocked within the land mass.The problem is that Science tells us the land mass was all in one place at one time, as the Bible tells us there was one land mass at one time. But all the water is not in one place, at the present. Then what was the geography in the description given in Genesis 1:9, 10? But you don't have all the water in one place with the current geography. No you would have to empty them of water and put the water in one place to satisfy Genesis 1:9.Take a good look at my present avatar and tell me is the dark blue which represents water all in one place.God Bless,

Hi Dr, I don't think I said there was 7 times the volume of water in the oceans at the time of Peleg.I did say there was 7 times the amount of water in the mantle as there is in the oceans.As to what the surface would look like before that event took place, I believe it would have looked like my avatar minus the body of landlocked water.I know there was a lot more water in that body of water that was in one place than there is in the oceans today.Maybe I didn't think it through with your mind but I did the best I could with my little uneducated mind.But I have been told that if the Earth was divided in an instant into the continents we have today there would have been an awful lot of heat generated that would have to have been cooled. The rocks would have gotten very hot and since they would have been in the water the water would have done a lot of changing.Now as to why we don't have any record of that event written down for us to read that would explain how we do not know whether those people knew what happened or not. Since they were scattered all over the face of the Earth they may have thought a big earthquake had taken place.God Bless,

Hi Percy, Are you saying that there was nothing but a big ball of water with a little ball of land in its center?Are you saying that somewhere in that ball of water God placed a firmament which He called heaven and our birds and airplanes fly around in today?There is water in the atmosphere now it is just not in the form that the water in the ocean is in. When it gets in the form that is in the ocean it falls to the ocean or Earth in the form of rain. Yes He created a firmament which He called Heaven.

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Genesis 1:8 And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day.

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What He called heaven and firmament is our atmosphere where birds and airplanes fly.But no he did not gather the waters beneath the firmament into one place namely the Earth.The Earth which is firm that can be walked upon was competely covered with water, thus it was wet land.

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Genesis 1:9 And God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry land appear: and it was so.

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1:10 And God called the dry land Earth; and the gathering together of the waters called he Seas: and God saw that it was good.

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So He gathered the water into one place and dry land appeared.I take that to be one body of water and one body of land, whatever the shape of the land was.Science tells us that the land mass was in one place at one time .The Bible tells me there was one body of land in whatever configuration it was in.Since I don't know what that configuration was I accept what Science says it was like.My avatar is a compacted version of Pangea, with a landlocked body of water in it.In my avatar is all the water in one place? And what does that have to do with the water being in one place as stated in Genesis 1:9? You still have the problem of all the landlocked bodies of water which is not connected to any other body of water.Thus the water is not all in one place. Is all the water on the Earth today in one place? Yes/NoIf 'yes' how do you connect the landlocked bodies of water throughout the world to make one body of water? It has everything to do with Noah's flood.To know how much water is required to cover the land mass you need to know what shape that land mass was and what the elevation of it was.If the land mass was as my avatar minus the landlocked body of water and was 1 foot above sea level a strong wind could have flooded the entire land mass.On the other hand the fountains of the deep could have opened up all around the land mass and the water would rise from all sides equally and the rain could have been a soft slow rain which would eliminate all the catastrophic things that are always argued about in flood threads.When the flood argument takes place there are too many unknowns that are passed over.Every argument I have seen so far has been that the Earth was in the same shape and elevations that it is today.It has been discussed many times how much water it would take to cover mount Everest.The question has been ask as to how people and animals got to the different contintents.Real stupid questions it the land mass was in one place and at a different elevation.That is the reason I have pretty much avoided the flood arguments until now.God Bless,

Hi Percy, I am saying that according to the text that on the seventh day all the water on planet Earth was in one place as stated in Genesis 1:9. I am saying according to the text there was one body of water as it was all collected to one place.The Earth (dry land of Genesis 1:10) was divided in the days of Peleg to our present configuration.Today there are many bodies of water.You did not answer my question, "Is all the water in my avatar in one place"? I have continually said that there was one (singular) body of water
according to Genesis 1:9 on planet Earth prior to the flood of Noah. If I understand you, you are saying that there are many bodies of water today.But Genesis 1:9 says the water was gathered to one (singular) place. Are you suggesting that the water was floating around in space and was then gathered onto a ball of dirt called Earth with a land mass sticking out of it? Just as soon as we can figure out what it was that was flooded.According to the text of Genesis 1:9, 10 all the water was in one place leaving one land mass protruding out of the water.Since in this thread we are discussing what the KJV Bible, LXX, and Hebrew text says about the flood we should be able to use what the same text says about the geography of the Earth at that time.Since there is no text that says there was a change in the water being in one place with dry land protruding from it until after the flood it should be apparant that at the time of the flood all the water was in one place with dry land protuding from it.So if it could be agreed that the text says all the water was in one place with dry land protruding from it we could move on to other details.God Bless,

Hi NoNukes, I argue to be specific.Either the water was all in one place or it was in more than one place. That is a possibility with the inland seas and bodies of water being left after the flood.But then the statement that the earth was divided in Genesis 10:25 would be out of place and unnecessary. Well no because when God created the heavens and the Earth in Genesis 1:1 it had no seas. The created Earth was competely covered in water somewhere between Genesis 1:1 and 1:2, as that is the way it is described in 1:2. Yes I can agree with that. Glad to see that my avatar minus the landlocked body of water could be a picture of what the Earth looked like in Genesis 1:10.You did not answer my question if all the water in my avatar was in one place or not. So anything that goes against what you believe and have been taught is to be ignored or ran away from.Wouldn't it be better to question everything rather than just a few things that you don't believe?But it is your choice.God Bless,

Hi Panda, What science says about the geography of the Earth is not off topic in this thread.Asking for scientific evidence to support a position in this thread is off topic.So the Bible and Science agreeing that at one time all the land mass was in one place is just verification that the Bible is correct about that event. Nope, all it says that the water was collected to one place and dry land protruded up out of the water. The text does not describe the shape of the dry land.It just states that dry land appeared when the water was collected to one place.Anything else is left up to imagination or what Science tells us.I choose to go with what Science tells us about the land being in one place at one time, which would have caused the water to be in one place.God Bless,

Hi CS, Close. But the last one has already taken place.

1.  In the Beginning God created the Heavens and the Earth. Genesis
    1:1.
2.  The history of Genesis 1:1 is given in Genesis 2:4 through
    Genesis 4:25.
3.  The seven days of Moses is recorded in Genesis 1:2 throuth
    Genesis 2:3.
4.  About 1700 years pass and man is wicked and God decides to
    remove them from among the living, but Noah found grace in the
    eyes of God. Genesis 6:8
5.  At this time all the water is still gathered into one place as it was
    in Genesis 1:9, 10 with the dry land protruding out of the water.
6.  The people as they move eastward decide to build a tower to
    heaven so they will not be scattered abroad over the face of the
    Earth.  Genesis 11:4.
7.  At this time the people all spoke one language. Genesis 11:6.
8.  God scattered the people over the face of the Earth (dry land of
    Genesis 1:9). Genesis 11:8.
9.  Peleg was born about 100 years after the flood and lived for
    239 years, during which time the Earth was divided.  Genesis
    10:25. 

I hope this is what you was asking for.

Hi Panda, Science can only say what it says.Scientist on the other hand can say science says anything that suits their fancy or biases. Makes no difference what you say it is, they both agree that at one time there was one land mass. Concerning spiritual things and man's relations with man yes.But there are many things that are not covered in the Scriptures.It doesn't give a full detailed explanation of how everything began to exist.But it does a better job that Science. But if all the land was in one place at one time that would leave all the water in one place. You mean they can't agree on events that have happened in the past?I say they can and do and science does not disprove nor can it disprove a flood.That is the reason for determining exactly what the KJV, LXX, and Hebrew text says about the Earth at the time of the flood.If the Earth was as I present it and a flood took place and the Earth was then divided there would be no evidence left behind that could be found to support a world wide flood. There would be evidence of a flood in all of the land mass that was above water at that time but the land mass that was under the water that was in one place would have different evidence and some that protruded up through the land that was at the bottom of the water would have something different.God Bless,

Hi Panda, Well no.Scientist and others say Science says there was no global flood.But without knowing the geography of the Earth at the time of the flood no conclusion can be reached. So which piece of information was taken out of context.Pangea existed. Water in one place and dry land in one place.Bible says water in one place leaving dry land in one place. But that water was added to my avatar today so I could ask the question, "is all the water in my avatar in the same place"?So thanks for confirming that the water in my avatar is not all in one place. I have presented what the KJV Bible say about the events I have described so far as well as the confirmation that Science has given in the past to the land mass being in one place at one time requiring all the water to be in one place at one time.And if we keep stumbling around on determining the geography of the Earth at the time of the Noah flood we will never get to any specific details about the flood.If we do not know what the Earth was like when the flood took place there is no way of determining what happened. Once it is determined what the geography was when the flood took place then we can discuss any information Biblical or Scientific as to whether the flood took place or not.But to say Science disproves the flood without knowing what the Earth's geography was at the time of the flood is asinine. Lets examine what the KJV Bible says:

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Genesis 1:9 And God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry land appear: and it was so.

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Does that say all the water under heaven was gathered to one place?Does that say dry land appeared?

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Genesis 1:10 And God called the dry land Earth; and the gathering together of the waters called he Seas: and God saw that it was good.

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Does that say God called the dry land Earth?

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Genesis 7:17 And the flood was forty days upon the earth; and the waters increased, and bare up the ark, and it was lift up above the earth.

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Does this say there was a flood upon the Earth?

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Genesis 10:25 And unto Eber were born two sons: the name of one was Peleg; for in his days was the earth divided; and his brother's name was Joktan.

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Does that say in the days of Peleg the Earth was divided?

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Genesis10:32 These are the families of the sons of Noah, after their generations, in their nations: and by these were the nations divided in the earth after the flood.

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Does this say the families of the sons of Noah were divided in the Earth after the flood?The very next verse in the text says:

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Genesis 11:1 And the whole earth was of one language, and of one speech.

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Does this say there was one language?

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Genesis 11:8 So the LORD scattered them abroad from thence upon the face of all the earth: and they left off to build the city.

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Does this say they were scattered upon the face of 'ALL' the Earth?If you answer yes or no to all of these makes no difference because this is direct quotes from the text you or anyone else can read for themselves.So this is not what ICANT imagines the text says but exactly what the text says.Now we can get into my imaginations after we can conclude what the geography of the Earth was at the time of the Noah flood if a conclusion can ever be reached.If everyone here wants to declare that the Earth was just like it is today then there is no way to have a discussion.That is not what the KJV Bible, LXX, and Hebrew texts say the Earth looked like. It has all the water in one place and dry protruding out of the water.God Bless,